Stripped valve cover bolts.

Quoting turbowop:
I find I usually have to retorque them after a heat cycle or two, but have never had to use anything like RTV to keep them from back out. I use a socket on the end of a screwdriver handle. Pretty hard to overtorque them with that.



Instead of a anti seize which would help them come loose, I use the rtv as a lubricant because it eventually becomes a sort of bonding agent. I think that's why so many people have this issue. They swap vc's so much and never use anything on the aluminum threads to prevent galling and they eventually get so worn that they strip.

The rtv acts as a lubricant in the beginning, but then drys and helps keep the bolt in place.

 

Quoting turbowop:
I think when most people are doing builds or other maintenance they are working with a cold engine. I know I do. About the only time I remove anything on a warm motor is when removing spark plugs to do a compression test. I've *never* seen valve cover threads gall when removing them on a cold engine.


Well it's kind of like working with AN fittings which are also aluminum iirc. Try bolting those together with no anti seize and you can feel the resistance. If you keep doing it over time you will ruin the threads.

 

[turbowop]

Quoting PearsVR4:
Quoting turbowop:
I find I usually have to retorque them after a heat cycle or two, but have never had to use anything like RTV to keep them from back out. I use a socket on the end of a screwdriver handle. Pretty hard to overtorque them with that.



Instead of a anti seize which would help them come loose, I use the rtv as a lubricant because it eventually becomes a sort of bonding agent. I think that's why so many people have this issue. They swap vc's so much and never use anything on the aluminum threads to prevent galling and they eventually get so worn that they strip.

The rtv acts as a lubricant in the beginning, but then drys and helps keep the bolt in place.




I've owned 1051 since '98. 503 since '08. I can't even count/remember how many times I've had the valve covers off of both cars over the years. The engineers at Mitsubishi never put anything about lubricating or using threadlock on the valve cover bolts in the FSM, so I haven't. Never had an issue. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

 

[turbowop]

Quoting PearsVR4:
Quoting turbowop:
I think when most people are doing builds or other maintenance they are working with a cold engine. I know I do. About the only time I remove anything on a warm motor is when removing spark plugs to do a compression test. I've *never* seen valve cover threads gall when removing them on a cold engine.



Well it's kind of like working with AN fittings which are also aluminum iirc. Try bolting those together with no anti seize and you can feel the resistance. If you keep doing it over time you will ruin the threads.



AN fittings seal at the internal flare. I have several of them on 1051 and once again, don't use anything on the threads. Never had a problem. And what does that have to do with warming up the motor before tightening/loosening them?

 

Good for you. I'll take the word of fabricators and race car builders before yours.

I'm posting what I've found works for me. I like to use some rtv on those specific bolts and it seems to keep them in place. I like to use anti seize on my AN fittings to keep from galling the metal/threads. Try some anti seize next time you screw on your fittings, you'll notice a difference. Some people even recommend a thread paste. And yes, I know they are flared.

click

 

[turbowop]

Yeah, don't take my word for any of this. I haven't been wrenching on these cars for over 14 years or anything. WTF do I know? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif

 

[Barnes]

Quoting PearsVR4:
Well it's kind of like working with AN fittings which are also aluminum iirc. Try bolting those together with no anti seize and you can feel the resistance. If you keep doing it over time you will ruin the threads.



This is more of an issue with galling due to two materials that are susceptible to galling being used together. (Another good example is 304 stainless on 304 stainless) However, I believe quality AN fittings are hard anodized which helps significantly with surface hardness which should help prevent the problems you speak of. However I would believe you are correct that after enough times threading and unthreading an AN fitting you would eventually start to wear away the anodized coating. This would expose the base aluminum which would be much more prone to galling resulting in a ruined fitting.

I would suspect for a good portion of people with thread problems when it comes to valve cover bolts have problems due to two things. A) Overtightening (either be a previous owner or themselves) or B)Dirty threads in the hole or on the bolt. Over time this could really ruin the threads in the head. Any grit/dirt/etc on either threads will damage the aluminum in the head. Especially since you're using a steel bolt.

 

[turbowop]

Back when I ran racegas instead of methanol injection, before each race I'd disconnect the AN fitting from the fuel rail, connect a different AN fitting with a long hose attached, kick on the fuel pump and drain the 92 octane out of the tank. I did this every other weekend for years. That's a lot of R&R'ing of the same AN fittings over and over again and never once did I have an issue with galling. The same AN fittings are on the car and I just disconnected it again a week or so ago to move the AFPR out of the way to replace a leaking clutch master cylinder. Zero galling. My experience, through years of R&R's, show that antisieze is not necessary.

I'm no "race team" or big name fabricator, but my experience on these cars still means something, IMO. I own two well built GVR4's that are sitting in my garage on tires. Not jackstands. I wouldn't hesitate to take either one out of the garage to take on a road trip. I'd like to think that I know a little about wtf I'm talking about.

 

[Barnes]

What brand fitting was that Mark? I'm fairly confident that the issue of galling for AN fittings boils down to quality of the fitting (and thus the anodizing among other things) and the fact that people probably over tighten them. I mean really, who takes the time and money to buy a set of crows feet to properly tighten AN fittings?

 

[JNR]

Who uses a crows foot on an AN fitting /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif They make anodized aluminum AN fitting wrenches, but that's more for keeping the fittings looking nice and not getting marred since the aluminum is so soft and regular wrench generally has a tendency to slip, but they also have alum. or plastic inserts for your vise for hose assembly purposes. If you're real careful, a regular set of combo wrenches work just fine and you can always put those rubber ends on your tool (go one size up) or wrap your fitting with masking tape, too. They do have some wrenches that have more of the hex shape that work well, too.

I think most of the problem with AN fittings is cross-threading as some people make the mistake of pulling their work in with the threads, which is always a no-no and especially dealing with aluminum.

 

Quoting turbowop:
Yeah, don't take my word for any of this. I haven't been wrenching on these cars for over 14 years or anything. WTF do I know? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif



I've been wrenching on mitsus for years too, what's your point? Are you expecting me to ride your nuts like everyone else does because you own a clean galant? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif

You are splitting hairs here and it sounds like you would rather have a pissing contest than offer some constructive advice to the OP.

I said what works for me, you said what works for you.

 

Quoting turbowop:
Back when I ran racegas instead of methanol injection, before each race I'd disconnect the AN fitting from the fuel rail, connect a different AN fitting with a long hose attached, kick on the fuel pump and drain the 92 octane out of the tank. I did this every other weekend for years. That's a lot of R&R'ing of the same AN fittings over and over again and never once did I have an issue with galling. The same AN fittings are on the car and I just disconnected it again a week or so ago to move the AFPR out of the way to replace a leaking clutch master cylinder. Zero galling. My experience, through years of R&R's, show that antisieze is not necessary.

I'm no "race team" or big name fabricator, but my experience on these cars still means something, IMO. I own two well built GVR4's that are sitting in my garage on tires. Not jackstands. I wouldn't hesitate to take either one out of the garage to take on a road trip. I'd like to think that I know a little about wtf I'm talking about.



Good for you, you own two $4500 cars that have some mods. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

What's the argument here? You choose to not use anti seize on your AN fittings, I do.

This isn't even the topic at hand. The OP is having an issue with valve cover bolts coming loose and being stripped.

Go take a bath or clean your beard.

 

Quoting JNR:
Who uses a crows foot on an AN fitting /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif ... .....



Not me, don't know how that came up. I have a nice set of AN specific wrenches.

 

[turbowop]

I don't expect anybody to ride my nuts. Do you have some sort of chip on your shoulder because I have a nice car? The way I post on the forum now is no different than the way I did it before my car was "clean". Get over it.

And I'm not splitting hairs. What works for you is f***ing stupid, IMO. Putting RTV on the valve cover bolts is retarded and unnecessary. RTFM. It's not needed.

*edit* Jesus titty f***ing christ. I was trying to reply to your comment three posts up with this but you went on a reply spree. Figure out how to put multiple quotes in one reply.

 

[Noobsauce]

Pearsvr4
Comming from a race car builder/fabricator. I have never used anti seize on AN fittings due to the chance of them loosening on track. I have seen several other racers that do and have had sealing issues due to the fitting loosening up. But the one thing that i do is clean any and all debris off the threads.
But with that said if you want to use RTV or anti seize and it makes you sleep at night then more power to you my pops always said theres more then one way to skin a cat.. Plus if you did everything to the book in the flat rate world you would be a very poor person.

 

[turbowop]

And wasting time by adding unnecessary RTV or antisieze will make you even m0ar poor.

When using the FSM, you can change R&R steps to be quicker, but I would hope you wouldn't change torque values or required thread sealants/lockers/antisieze.

 

[Barnes]

Quoting PearsVR4:
Quoting JNR:
Who uses a crows foot on an AN fitting /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif ... .....



Not me, don't know how that came up. I have a nice set of AN specific wrenches.



Because you can't use a torque wrench on 95% of AN fittings unless you have a crows foot. :facepalm: And since people don't use torque wrenches because of this, who knows how tight they put the connections together.

Using a torque wrench might be overkill, but that could be the engineer in me. But given the conversation is about galling, surface pressure is the critical factor in galling situations. So if you are over tightening a fitting, this will cause galling. (Unlike steel bolts where the bolt generally breaks, or the threads are torn out before galling becomes the driving issue.)

 

[Noobsauce]

No I always go with the FSM in regards to torque specs, required sealants, exc.

 

[Noobsauce]

Barnes
I can see if someone wasn't sure on how tight to have the fitting then a torque wrench could help you. But over time you just get a feel for how tight is tight enough. (granted I say this for anything that is not a major engine component.

 

[Barnes]

There is certainly truth to that thus negating the need for the torque wrench. However, some people don't have a good enough feel for things like that to not repeat over tightening. And some people just never learn. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hsugh.gif