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mitsuturbo
Well-known member
Quoting mikus:
^ they're so classic you can't give away a shell for free.
I don't care for it, and if you want to sh*t on it because you don't like it that's your perogative - but to sh*t on it because someone prefers aesthetic modification of a car over performance is foolish. If someone is enthused about their car, good for them.
Often, "giving away a shell" means someone has already stripped the vehicle of anything worth using because something is fundamentally wrong with the vehicle. Such as bad rust, frame/body damage, burn victim... most of which is more expensive to repair than the vehicle would EVER be worth.
I'm not "shitting on" anything. I'm expressing my displeasure with the thought of performing detrimental mods to these cars. It's sh*t like this that contributes to the cause of a car getting stripped down, parted out, and left as a shell that cannot be given away. Not many people want a car that is hollowed out to nothing more than a frame, unless they have a wrecked donor to swap everything over from.
Take any GVR4 in halfway decent shape, that HAS NOT been stripped, and throw it on craigslist for a reasonable price. Even NON running, with a BAD engine or transmission, it WILL sell. It may take a little while, but someone will see it, or come up with the money after seeing in on there for weeks, and make the call. The reason these things get sent off to the crusher is that people mod them, get upside down in them monetarily, lose interest, and try to recoup losses by parting sh*t out. Cars are never an investment... especially these money pits. Especially if you do sh*t to them like add neon lights, pigeon playground "spoilers, airbags/hydraulics, rainbow tint, stretchy/pokey wheels/tires, low quality coilovers, APC parts from pep-boys or vato-zone, or any other on the laundry list of ricer mods that the GVR4 owner generally avoids like dog vomit. We don't generally do this kind of sh*t because we KNOW it's not a widely accepted practice, and therefore likely not a good idea.
^ they're so classic you can't give away a shell for free.
I don't care for it, and if you want to sh*t on it because you don't like it that's your perogative - but to sh*t on it because someone prefers aesthetic modification of a car over performance is foolish. If someone is enthused about their car, good for them.
Often, "giving away a shell" means someone has already stripped the vehicle of anything worth using because something is fundamentally wrong with the vehicle. Such as bad rust, frame/body damage, burn victim... most of which is more expensive to repair than the vehicle would EVER be worth.
I'm not "shitting on" anything. I'm expressing my displeasure with the thought of performing detrimental mods to these cars. It's sh*t like this that contributes to the cause of a car getting stripped down, parted out, and left as a shell that cannot be given away. Not many people want a car that is hollowed out to nothing more than a frame, unless they have a wrecked donor to swap everything over from.
Take any GVR4 in halfway decent shape, that HAS NOT been stripped, and throw it on craigslist for a reasonable price. Even NON running, with a BAD engine or transmission, it WILL sell. It may take a little while, but someone will see it, or come up with the money after seeing in on there for weeks, and make the call. The reason these things get sent off to the crusher is that people mod them, get upside down in them monetarily, lose interest, and try to recoup losses by parting sh*t out. Cars are never an investment... especially these money pits. Especially if you do sh*t to them like add neon lights, pigeon playground "spoilers, airbags/hydraulics, rainbow tint, stretchy/pokey wheels/tires, low quality coilovers, APC parts from pep-boys or vato-zone, or any other on the laundry list of ricer mods that the GVR4 owner generally avoids like dog vomit. We don't generally do this kind of sh*t because we KNOW it's not a widely accepted practice, and therefore likely not a good idea.
DR1665
Well-known member
Quoting mitsuturbo:
It's sh*t like this that contributes to the cause of a car getting stripped down, parted out, and left as a shell that cannot be given away. Not many people want a car that is hollowed out to nothing more than a frame, unless they have a wrecked donor to swap everything over from.
It's called "building a four door DSM."
GVR4s are dirt cheap for, among other reasons, their mechanical similarity to the DSM. So long as most people view these things as four door versions of the dime-a-dozen, beat-ass DSMs they see all day long on Craigslist, they're going to be treated - and valued - as such.
These are not four door DSMs.
1991...
BMW M3 (E30)
2.3L L4 - 195hp
Wheelbase: 101.1"
Curb Weight: 2865lbs
MSRP: $36-$38K
Mitsubishi Galant VR4 (E39A)
2.0L L4 - 190hp
Wheelbase: 102.4"
Curb Weight: 3270lbs
MSRP: $22K
Today, a good condition E30 M3 will bring in $20K easily. Why? Because they have a pedigree and people take care of them. They keep them clean, true to form, and respectable. The DSM will never achieve anything close to this. The Galant VR4, on the other hand, stands a chance, albeit a small one, but it will require us to keep them clean, true to form, and respectable.
Hella flush is none of the above. It's ignorant, pop culture, conformity on the lowest common denominator. Sorry, but you're doing it wrong.
It's sh*t like this that contributes to the cause of a car getting stripped down, parted out, and left as a shell that cannot be given away. Not many people want a car that is hollowed out to nothing more than a frame, unless they have a wrecked donor to swap everything over from.
It's called "building a four door DSM."
GVR4s are dirt cheap for, among other reasons, their mechanical similarity to the DSM. So long as most people view these things as four door versions of the dime-a-dozen, beat-ass DSMs they see all day long on Craigslist, they're going to be treated - and valued - as such.
These are not four door DSMs.
1991...
BMW M3 (E30)
2.3L L4 - 195hp
Wheelbase: 101.1"
Curb Weight: 2865lbs
MSRP: $36-$38K
Mitsubishi Galant VR4 (E39A)
2.0L L4 - 190hp
Wheelbase: 102.4"
Curb Weight: 3270lbs
MSRP: $22K
Today, a good condition E30 M3 will bring in $20K easily. Why? Because they have a pedigree and people take care of them. They keep them clean, true to form, and respectable. The DSM will never achieve anything close to this. The Galant VR4, on the other hand, stands a chance, albeit a small one, but it will require us to keep them clean, true to form, and respectable.
Hella flush is none of the above. It's ignorant, pop culture, conformity on the lowest common denominator. Sorry, but you're doing it wrong.
SouthCaliVR4
Well-known member
Might as well turn it into a donk & argue the merits of that. Most of us on this site are more interested in performance & having a car that is the exact opposite of standing out in a crowd. Remember 90% of the population will wonder why the hell you did that to a Camry & the other ten percent will despise what you've done to our beloved vr4.
That said, do what you want it's your car but just don't expect others to commend or compliment taking away from the one thing these rather plain four doors have going for them, performance. And enjoy doing wheel brgs & tires with the frequency of oil changes.
That said, do what you want it's your car but just don't expect others to commend or compliment taking away from the one thing these rather plain four doors have going for them, performance. And enjoy doing wheel brgs & tires with the frequency of oil changes.
FCR
Well-known member
Hellaflush = Agressive wheels offset
Somes guys seem to take it to the extremes, as well as a few others here and there. But "hellaflush" and "stance" can look nice when done on the right car with the right wheels.
Some examples of this trend that don't make me want to vomit:
Somes guys seem to take it to the extremes, as well as a few others here and there. But "hellaflush" and "stance" can look nice when done on the right car with the right wheels.
Some examples of this trend that don't make me want to vomit:
damn, that's a good looking evo ^^
belize1334
Well-known member
Some of those aren't bad but IMHO as soon as the tire-wall has the wrong pitch (stretched) it becomes completely retarded. If you want to push the limits of how close you can get to the fender then that's fine, but don't mount a skinny tire on an enormous wheel. It has no performance benefit and it looks stupid.
FCR
Well-known member
"It has no performance benefit and it looks stupid"
IT HAS NO PERFORMANCE /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif and what happend with one of the fastest evo in the word????
IT HAS NO PERFORMANCE /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif and what happend with one of the fastest evo in the word????
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SouthCaliVR4
Well-known member
Camber on that car "looks" correct & it's not driven on the street. back in the day everyone was into Pro-Street. it was just as stupid. Even front drive cars where sporting skinnies up front & steam rollers in the back, ninety nine percent where slow as f*** & had done it for looks. I used to earn a lot of money off pro-street guys.
the real world (driving on the street) involves driveways, potholes & speed bumps. how well do you think that evo would handle driving on the street?
the real world (driving on the street) involves driveways, potholes & speed bumps. how well do you think that evo would handle driving on the street?
belize1334
Well-known member
Quoting FCR:
"It has no performance benefit and it looks stupid"
IT HAS NO PERFORMANCE /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif and what happend with one of the fastest evo in the word????
That's completely different. Those tires are sized correctly for those wheels. They've been chosen to be on the narrow side in increase sidewall stiffness but they're still properly seated. What I'm ranting about is stuff like this...
The tire has been deformed to fit the wheel. It has NO PERFORMANCE BENEFIT!!! And it LOOKS STUPID!!!
"It has no performance benefit and it looks stupid"
IT HAS NO PERFORMANCE /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif and what happend with one of the fastest evo in the word????
That's completely different. Those tires are sized correctly for those wheels. They've been chosen to be on the narrow side in increase sidewall stiffness but they're still properly seated. What I'm ranting about is stuff like this...
The tire has been deformed to fit the wheel. It has NO PERFORMANCE BENEFIT!!! And it LOOKS STUPID!!!
FCR
Well-known member
I use to run my VR4 on PR where the streets are bad as hell without any problem with my Solo 1 set up(with a lot of camber on the front and rear) and for me the car feels better than the factory or "normal" setup. But we are not talking only about camber or suspension setup, I make my comment base on the topic about hellaflush = aggressive wheels offset "fittment" with strech tire etc and the comment about "It has no performance benefit" but in the other hand some guys outhere for me pass the line and do things very extreme.
just my o2 cents /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
just my o2 cents /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
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Quoting Whoodoo:
So to put it plainly, 16x8 +0 won't work.
Agreed, you'll run into issues with the steering tie-rod hitting the chassis in the front, and the upper arm hitting the chassis in the rear before you get it anywhere near low enough.
Once you sort that and lower it some more the crossmember and gearbox will literally be sitting on the ground.
I think it's like anything, a little bit is okay but if you take it to extremes it just gets silly.
Toyo recommend at least a 225/40 for a 9" wide rim, if you stick with that guideline you're not compromising the tyres shape when you fit it, so it should still handle fine.
For a street car which you're not going to be driving anywhere near the limit I don't think it really matters very much at all though. Just keep an eye on your tyre pressures!
So to put it plainly, 16x8 +0 won't work.
Agreed, you'll run into issues with the steering tie-rod hitting the chassis in the front, and the upper arm hitting the chassis in the rear before you get it anywhere near low enough.
Once you sort that and lower it some more the crossmember and gearbox will literally be sitting on the ground.
I think it's like anything, a little bit is okay but if you take it to extremes it just gets silly.
Toyo recommend at least a 225/40 for a 9" wide rim, if you stick with that guideline you're not compromising the tyres shape when you fit it, so it should still handle fine.
For a street car which you're not going to be driving anywhere near the limit I don't think it really matters very much at all though. Just keep an eye on your tyre pressures!
NateCrisman
Well-known member
Hellaflush? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif 17 x 8.5" wheels with +35mm offset. They just barely fit with the front camber plate maxed out negative and the strut/hub "slop" also on the full negative camber setting. The tires are 235-45-17 that were a pita to get seated because they really aren't wide enough for the wheel.
Most of you guy know I couldn't give a flying F about looks for the most part, Im all straight line performance. Just posted to show another situation of what I consider barely streetable wide wheel with barely fit offset.
TSimage
Well-known member
LOL @ how opinionated some of you are...
Its borderline pathetic. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
People laugh at you for fixing up "buckets" let them do what they want to their cast and stop acting like bitches on their rags. good lord, if only a hand full of people valued many of your opinions as highly as you did, you might get somewhere or be somebody in this life time. For now, keep on with those small town ideals. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/applause.gif
Oh and Nate.. Not flush bro lol.
Its borderline pathetic. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
People laugh at you for fixing up "buckets" let them do what they want to their cast and stop acting like bitches on their rags. good lord, if only a hand full of people valued many of your opinions as highly as you did, you might get somewhere or be somebody in this life time. For now, keep on with those small town ideals. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/applause.gif
Oh and Nate.. Not flush bro lol.
mitsuturbo
Well-known member
Your car looks DAMN good, Nate! That's the direction i would like to take with mine once i get all the powertrain taken care of.
There are a few GVR4s out there by which others should be judged. 1051 is of course the first, yours is up there too, right along with
which i believe is currently up for sale.
There are a few GVR4s out there by which others should be judged. 1051 is of course the first, yours is up there too, right along with
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Quoting NateCrisman:
The tires are 235-45-17 that were a pita to get seated because they really aren't wide enough for the wheel.
What brand of tyre are they?
According to Toyo they are happy for a 235/45/17 to go on 7.5" - 9" wide rims. Even a 215/40/17 is okay for an 8.5" rim.
specs here: click
I don't really understand why they would be difficult to fit, unless the bead seating areas on the rims were dirty or damaged?
p.s. my cars perfectly streetable (when the dampers are set to 'soft' anyway) with .5 inch more rim width, 1 inch more diameter, 5mm less offset and 2 inches or so less ride height - though it did take some work on the 'fenders' to make it so.
I'm designing a roll centre/bump steer correction kit at the moment, though it isn't noticeably worse than it was before with just aftermarket springs and 215/40/17's.
The tires are 235-45-17 that were a pita to get seated because they really aren't wide enough for the wheel.
What brand of tyre are they?
According to Toyo they are happy for a 235/45/17 to go on 7.5" - 9" wide rims. Even a 215/40/17 is okay for an 8.5" rim.
specs here: click
I don't really understand why they would be difficult to fit, unless the bead seating areas on the rims were dirty or damaged?
p.s. my cars perfectly streetable (when the dampers are set to 'soft' anyway) with .5 inch more rim width, 1 inch more diameter, 5mm less offset and 2 inches or so less ride height - though it did take some work on the 'fenders' to make it so.
I'm designing a roll centre/bump steer correction kit at the moment, though it isn't noticeably worse than it was before with just aftermarket springs and 215/40/17's.
I did the 5 lug swap and i tried putting on my 3000gt sl wheels it looks sick but rubs. so im going to have to put spacers on but im not sure if thats the way i wanna go.
my goal is to have a 400hp car that looks basically stock.
turbowop
Well-known member
Quoting TSimage:
LOL @ how opinionated some of you are...
Its borderline pathetic. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
People laugh at you for fixing up "buckets" let them do what they want to their cast and stop acting like bitches on their rags. good lord, if only a hand full of people valued many of your opinions as highly as you did, you might get somewhere or be somebody in this life time. For now, keep on with those small town ideals. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/applause.gif
Oh and Nate.. Not flush bro lol.
lol @ the n00b. Threads like this make it so easy to see who on the board is worth paying attention to, and who isn't. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowrofl.gif
I make fun of emos as well. Or any other retarded fad that is sure to be gone in a short amount of time.
LOL @ how opinionated some of you are...
Its borderline pathetic. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif
People laugh at you for fixing up "buckets" let them do what they want to their cast and stop acting like bitches on their rags. good lord, if only a hand full of people valued many of your opinions as highly as you did, you might get somewhere or be somebody in this life time. For now, keep on with those small town ideals. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/applause.gif
Oh and Nate.. Not flush bro lol.
lol @ the n00b. Threads like this make it so easy to see who on the board is worth paying attention to, and who isn't. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowrofl.gif
I make fun of emos as well. Or any other retarded fad that is sure to be gone in a short amount of time.
mitsuturbo
Well-known member
I'd offer more opinion on this matter, but this is gvr4, not posdsm
Let's just have it suffice to say that i personally believe if you're going to OWN a gvr4, you should modify it tastefully, or restore it completely.
Let's just have it suffice to say that i personally believe if you're going to OWN a gvr4, you should modify it tastefully, or restore it completely.
this is no better than vwvortex or honda-tech. You ask a question and get an opinion. i love my my gvr4 but im not going to treat it like a supercar. so im going to build it the way that i like it.
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