Same day after rebuild engine broke, HELP!!!

[theevozero]

Quoting transparentdsm:
as for the oil hole, that would have caused the oil pump to fail, as that is the crank case and it needs the pressure. so with the bolt out, oil has less pressure, the oil pump wasn't sucking enough oil to go through all the galleys


Incorrect, so incorrect! That hole would NEVER effect oil pressure. Just cause an oil leak.

Honestly, these motor issues sound like either, bad machine work or low oil pressure. 10 psi at idle with the engine warm, is pretty normal....

Also, if the crank keeps walking, it could potentially cause disengagement issues. But your problems are much bigger. I always replace by pivot ball and fork when in doubt.

 

[toybreaker]

Quoting BogusSVO:
Joey T and GSTwithPSI

To me it looks like you made a simple engine build mistake.

You both confused the main bearing halves. The upper (block) and lower (main caps)

The uppers have oil holes so the oil can pass through the main bearing and feed oil to the mains, then onto the rods.

If you go back and look at the pics you both posted, you will see the oil holes/grooved upper main bearings in the main caps.

On King bearings, the lower main bearings are solid, no holes, no grooves.

Both these engines were going to fail in minutes. Due to the oil galleys to the crank being blocked off.

NIB King 6 bolt main bearings


I just opened this package for this thread. Solid bearings (top row) fit in the main caps, The lower row (with grooves and holes) fit in the block






Good catch, Dale!

Didn't look too hard at the other pics

Not feeding the rod bearings because the shells in the crank journals are reversed will cause some carnage, thats' for sure.

... didn't see too many of these types of problems with the clientele we serviced, just issues with cleaniless, and mis-clocked bse installs.





I saw the progressive failure evident in the rod bearings and assumed it was a progessive starvation issue.

... just had one come thru last month with kilt rod bearings that had hung squirters.

That's what I get for not putting on my glasses and looking harder at the pics. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif


Good catch, solid post, well handled /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


[edit] have you seen full groove main bearing sets for the 4g?

 

[theevozero]

Well there you go, the answer was right in front of us.

 

[BogusSVO]

I am fairly sure that both the ACL Race, and the King HP or XP are both full groove mains.

GSTwithPSI was by yesterday, and I spoke with him about his pic, He used basic ACL bearings and says they were full grooved. Ill have to get my hands on a set and find out.

 

[mitsuturbo]

I can't believe i didn't see that issue by the photos as well. Very nice, BogusSVO. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/applause.gif

 

[BogusSVO]

Thanks guys!

I tend to go through a few of these short blocks on a regular basis, I had looked at the pics a few times before it clicked in my noggin.

It also helped that I just bedded a crank the day before.

I hope the OP can survive another build and get up and running!

 

[GSTwithPSI]

Quoting BogusSVO:
I am fairly sure that both the ACL Race, and the King HP or XP are both full groove mains.

GSTwithPSI was by yesterday, and I spoke with him about his pic, He used basic ACL bearings and says they were full grooved. Ill have to get my hands on a set and find out.



Great catch Dale. Not sure about the other bearings mentioned, but the normal ACL (non-race) bearings have the same size oil hole both top and bottom were both also full grooved. Looks like the OP didn't fall in the same boat. A few pics from my build:

Normal ACLs

Oil Groove

 

[JoeyTredia]

Quoting BogusSVO:
Joey T and GSTwithPSI

To me it looks like you made a simple engine build mistake.

You both confused the main bearing halves. The upper (block) and lower (main caps)

The uppers have oil holes so the oil can pass through the main bearing and feed oil to the mains, then onto the rods.

If you go back and look at the pics you both posted, you will see the oil holes/grooved upper main bearings in the main caps.

On King bearings, the lower main bearings are solid, no holes, no grooves.

Both these engines were going to fail in minutes. Due to the oil galleys to the crank being blocked off.

NIB King 6 bolt main bearings


I just opened this package for this thread. Solid bearings (top row) fit in the main caps, The lower row (with grooves and holes) fit in the block


Now the crank will need to be replaced, or ground undersized. The housing bores of the con rods need to be torqued and checked for round and spec, the main bores need to be torqued and checked also.

With as much head that was made when the engine was running, I would expect the Main bores and the big end of the rods to be distorted.

Keep in mind, the difference between high and low spec on the housing bores is .0007

Now with the low oil pressure, you have another issue, if a BSE has been done, make sure the front (exhaust side) BS bearings have been flipped to block off the oil feed ports to them (Front BS is out of engine)

With the main bearings being in the wrong locations, oil pressure should have been high, 80-100+ psi or more. (some engines see this with just a BSE.

Another thing to check is to make sure the gasket for the oil pick up screen is in place, if not this will allow for the pump to suck air easier than oil.



BULL'S-EYE!!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jawdrop.gif BogusSVO, after physically analyzing what you pointed out i realized my big mistake (dumb me /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif) that's what happens when replacing bearings the same way the prior ones were installed and not double-checking. Lesson learned (the hard way though). I just bought an new OEM oil pump, used OEM std. crank (like new, measured and within specs) and of course new King main and ACL rod bearings. Everything will be going to a reputable local machine shop so they can work their magic and have it ready. That being said, i will be putting an end to this post or thread not before being very grateful for everyone who took a moment from their valuable time, knowledge and expertise to contribute in many ways on this issue i confronted. I will definitely keep you updated on this build as soon i have it ready. Again, thanks a lot to every single member who stepped in here and for making me feel part of this great VR-4 community. Blessings, until then...Joey. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
this is a some time ago pic, front bumper removed for touch up.


New wheels, will be painted though.


I would like to share a vid i made when i first got the car in a tribute to GVR4's. Enjoy...
youtube