just wanting to use a 2g cylinder head...

[3rdstrikedsm]

Just look at the evo 8 manifold, The e1-3 is almost the exact same. evo 8-9 guys get over 600whp with this mani and don't loose any low end as a trade off. Just a way better design than the 1g or the 2g.

You can just use a 2g head if you are going to port it and try to find an evo 1-3 manifold with coilpack but that is usally hard to do.

 

[ctm]

3rdstrikedsm - thanks for the clarifications and the additional information.

an interesting option was recently proposed by a technician at a local Mitsu dealership. he suggested to use a 1.6L cylinder head and an intake mani from a turbo Mirage. my first thought was that this would address the need to up the flow velocity, thereby increasing response. i don't have the numbers nor the technical expertise (in no way am I a fluid dynamics guru nor a mechanical engineer). however, i have a hunch that turbo Mirage head's volumetric efficiency may not be as good as the 1G or 2g, and that overall the 2g strikes that nice balance of velocity and volume/flow efficiency.

has anyone (or someone you know) successfully tried using a 1.6L cylinder head and intake mani from a turbo Mirage on a 6 bolt 4g63 block?

 

[89coltgt]

The 1.6 head will work, but keep in mind the combustion chamber is smaller than the 2.0 head. There is some info about this on 4g61t.org, but most of the guys over there are swapping 1.8 hyundai heads on the 1.6.

 

[kaiju]

The 1.8 reportedly has the same size combustion chamber size as the 2.0l head but with the smaller ports of the 1.6

 

[gaylantvr4]

1.8l hyundia head has the big ports and a 43cc com chamber.
The 1.6l mirage head has oval ports like a honda. The head also comes on a hyundia sonata w a 2.0l. I used one in my 95 4g63 swaped galant worked great.
If i mean if you can get ahold of a galant gs head they are 2g ports with the 43cc combustion chamber to give you a tab bit more compression. It took me years to find 2 of them.

 

[Luke]

Quoting ctm:

as to using the 2g T-stat housing, comments from slugsgomoo and grocery_getter (offline) imply that I'll have to. QUESTIONS: i recall the 2g unit has coolant/radiator cap on it... will this part be discarded when one swaps all the sensors from the gvr4 T-stat housing?




You can use GVR4 T-stat housing on a 2g head. You simply have to move one or two mounting studs on the 2G head. The holes are already on the correct location, and tapped.
This is the setup that I run. Ported 2g head with 1g intake manifold.

 

[ctm]

Luke - thanks for the additional info re: the use of 1g peripherals with a 2g head.

89coltgt & kaiju - appreciate your input on the 1.6l (turbo mirage) and 1.8 (hyundai) cylinder heads, respectively.

gaylantvr4 - thanks for the detailed info and thanks also for clarifying offline the following information:

1) the hyundia 1.6 head is the same as the sonata 2.0 head; both have oval ports like a honda
2) the hyundia 1.8 head is like a 1g dsm head but has the 43cc combustion chamber
3) it was not clear if the jdm 4g61ts heads are the same as the 1.6 or 1.8 head [he did indicate that most turbo mirage guys would rather use a 1.8 hyundai head and will not use a 1g dsm head, which will lower the compression way too much]
4) the galant gs is the most interesting option outside of using a 2g head, which is what prompted me to start this thread to begin with. apparently it has 2g ports and 43cc combustion chambers.

So now for some follow-up questions:

A) is the 43cc combustion chamber an improvement from that of the 1g (what is so special about the 43cc value/size)? [also curious what is the volume of the 1g head?]
B) does the 2g head have a 43cc combustion chamber? if not what is its volume?
C) concerning the 2g ports on a galant gs head, does this mean that the 2g (or equivalent, at least at the intake mani/head interface) is a direct bolt on with NO need for:
1) porting (something i definitely do not want to do),
2) special gaskets (ie, it is OK to use OEM 2g or equivalent intake mani gaskets), or
3) mods to such gaskets?

TIA

 

[gaylantvr4]

all the smaller combustion chamber is really doing is adding compression. i believe it is a 1/2 a point but correct me if i am wrong. 94 galant gs head has the same ports as a 2g but a smaller combustion chamber 43cc. that is my build for my 2g 4g64 w wiseco 10:0-1 hd's galant gs head with an evo 3 intake manifold.

 

[ktmrider]

^^ That's about right on the CR bump, coarse rule o' thumb is 0.1 increase per 1cc change.
You run into other potential issues ( valve shielding in smaller cylinders, gasket sealing, etc ) but overall can be an easy way to increase compression.

 

[FlyingEagle]

Quote:

it was not clear if the jdm 4g61ts heads are the same as the 1.6 or 1.8 head [he did indicate that most turbo mirage guys would rather use a 1.8 hyundai head and will not use a 1g dsm head, which will lower the compression way too much]




4g61t (marked 1.6 on the head CAS side) heads use the small combustion chamber size = ~43cc
4g61t (marked 1.8 on the head CAS side) heads use the small combustion chamber and have large ports like the 4g67 and 4g63 (1G)
4g61t rare but are out there, heads that have a combination small/large port combination setup, most likely large intake, small exhaust. Not likely to see this on our side of the ocean as it appeared to come on certain JDM market cars. Not definitive as people said they got their car this way. 1.6 heads are more rare than 1.8L Hyundai heads, so some JDM market members, end up with 1.8L heads on their 1.6L blocks because of previous repair by PO's.
4g67 (1.8L) heads use the small combustion chamber and larger style ports (aka DSM sized)
4g63 1G heads has the larger combustion chamber and large style ports

Guys with the 4g61t setup are basically trying to match early 1G style parts with the small chamber and larger ports, with matching larger port peripherals as part of an early system design of somewhat, bigger is better, or at least proven to make some good power up top where the 4g61t gets to rev due to Rod and Stroke ratio.
With a good 2G head on a 4g61 cranked block, it may help to make for better bottom end, and still provide better overall power with a smaller runner size, but yet more efficient in just about every aspect. This 2G head discussion has peaked my interest, as I have a spare 4g61t sitting around and it may sway me to look into options other than the 1G style options. That's my 2 cents for anyone that was curious.

 

FWIW I have good 1.6L colt head for sale if anyone wants to go down that road...

 

[mysticj]

Quoting gaylantvr4:
all the smaller combustion chamber is really doing is adding compression. i believe it is a 1/2 a point but correct me if i am wrong. 94 galant gs head has the same ports as a 2g but a smaller combustion chamber 43cc. that is my build for my 2g 4g64 w wiseco 10:0-1 hd's galant gs head with an evo 3 intake manifold.



I thought the compression difference between the GS and the rest of the Galants were the pistons, and that the GS and 2G share the same cylinder head. If so, then my 4G67 head swap proves somewhat fruitless for I was aiming to have higher compression...

 

[Bimmubishi]

I got my engine together with the Evo III head and manifold. Dyno testing will be forthcoming once I rebuild my gearbox full of neutrals.

 

[Rausch]

Looks good Alex! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/applause.gif

This made me laugh WAY too hard : Quote:
Dyno testing will be forthcoming once I rebuild my gearbox full of neutrals.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif

 

[G]

Oh nice, how big are those sards? 1000cc?

 

[Bimmubishi]

G I think that they're 880s

 

[dsmer06]

I was told on the 4g61t website that the compression ratio is raised by .2 with the 1.8 head, and that the 1g combustion chamber is 45cc, is this correct?

 

[mysticj]

Came across this, it's pretty interesting...

Cylinder head Part Number
Evo 3, RVR HSG, RVR SSG: MD334948(Was superceded from MD327728)
Galant GS, 95-96 Eclipse: MD334948
RVR SG: MD334949
96-99 Eclipse: MD334949

 

[FlyingEagle]

Quoting dsmer06:
I was told on the 4g61t website that the compression ratio is raised by .2 with the 1.8 head, and that the 1g combustion chamber is 45cc, is this correct?



None of the many people performing this swap have posted physical results and engine shop measurements to confirm whether or not +0.5:1 or +0.2:1 or something in between is the actual compression ration increase from bolting on a 1.8 NA DOHC head to a 4g61t block, so it makes it difficult to do anything but speculate as opposed to having concrete evidence to support any number for or against.

 

[gaylantvr4]

nope eclipse has the 47cc chamber galant gs has 43cc chamber and galant sohc also has a 47cc i think the pistons have the same numbers on the domes on the galant motors.