Guess What? Another clutch question/problem

[rdomeck]

Ok....So I purchased my car and it has always shifted notchy and stiff....I had the engine out to rebuild and didn't see anything out of line with the clutch. When re-installing I made some adjustments to the cables as they were off. Maybe a little better, but still not what it should be. So I purchased a used stage 2 trans from a local guy and installed it....Maybe a little different, but still not right.

I replaced the slave and master and it is bleed and adjusted correctly. Still not right. I have done the test to put it in 1st with the clutch in and the car moves. So clutch is dragging. I pulled the trans back out this afternoon expecting to find the step machined wrong on the flywheel....It measures .612-.618. It is a Centerforce pressure plate, I'm not sure about the disc and a stock flywheel.

I plan on replacing the bearing, fork and ball, but I'm kinda getting tired of pulling the trans. Anything else that I can look for?

 

[thecman02]

How's the clutch pedal assembly? If there's any play it will need to be fixed, also I found adding more shims under the pivot ball has helped before. With my old Southbend Clutch it needed a second shim. It seems being just to the right of the clutch fork hole centerline isn't good enough.

 

[Jason G.]

Can you remember how the fork sat against the slave when it was installed?

 

[rdomeck]

Clutch pedal assembly is fine and everything was adjusted as per the video that I believe Jack's Trans put up on Youtube....The fork was right in the middle of the centerline if not a little to the drivers side!

 

[rdomeck]

Oh, and the pivot ball had one washer under it!

 

[rdomeck]

I have yet to measure out my other problem...My axle seals were leaking so I replaced them with brand new Mitsu ones. They are still leaking just as bad...... I will pull them out and slip them on the axles to check them out!

 

[SleepinGVR4]

Check the clutch fluid lever and see if where the clevis pin goes through is still a round hold and not "oval-ed" out. Also check the clevis pin for low spot where it makes contact with the clutch fluid lever.

 

[rdomeck]

I have checked the pedal cluster, but I am going to pull it to be sure nothing is going on with it. Ordered a new fork, ball and bearing today. Thinking of sending the clutch out to Fort Wayne Clutch to have it rebuilt although I don't see or measure anything wrong with it.

Just frustrating when you can't put a reason to something!

 

[toybreaker]

Quoting rdomeck:
Thinking of sending the clutch out to Fort Wayne Clutch to have it rebuilt although I don't see or measure anything wrong with it.

Just frustrating when you can't put a reason to something!




... you already "found" the "problem"



Quoting rdomeck:
I pulled the trans back out this afternoon expecting to find the step machined wrong on the flywheel....It measures .612-.618. It is a Centerforce pressure plate, I'm not sure about the disc and a stock flywheel.





.612 = goodness

.618 = *potential* issues with the release geometry


.612 - .618 on the same flywheel equals .006 taper

That will give you all kinds of troubles,

... including the one you described in your original post.


Not to be rude/condescending, but damn man, you need to do a better job of measuring things!

six thou variance and/or taper on a flywheel might as well be a mile when it comes to the release characteristics of the clutch set-up in these cars.


Use a quality machinists straight edge and a depth micrometer, and get some verifiable measurements at several different spots around the circumference and at different spots from the outer edge to the center and report back.


... till then all anybody can do is "guess" as to what your problems may be. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

 

[rdomeck]

Agreed on the measurement.....This was using a depth gauge at each pressure plate mounting location and was not the most accurate way to measure. Going to find a local shop to machine flywheel, install new arm, ball and bearing and see how that does.

Thanks for the input and I'll post up my results!

 

[rdomeck]

Alright, I had my pressure plate machined today and my machinist said that it was warped really bad and that was more than likely my clutch engagement issue. As much as I would like to just throw this thing back together I now want to check my pressure plate, but I'm not really sure how? It's a Centerforce pressure plate, with an unknown disc. Although it could also by Centerforce, just don't see a name on it!

I guess my question is, how do I measure the pressure plate? I don't mind buying a new one if I need to, but I would like to be sure before spending the money!

 

[turbowop]

Is it even possible to machine the pressure plate and still maintain a proper step height on our clutches? When the flywheel is machined, they also machine the bosses around the outside of it that the pressure plate sits on to get the correct step height. How would you go about doing that to a pressure plate? The part that mounts to the flywheel is stamped steel and doesn't have a lot of meat. Or maybe I'm thinking about this the wrong way. Maybe machining the pressure plate would just lessen the clamping force a little?

If it were me, I'd pick up a new clutch and start over. That way you know exactly what you have in there. I've been extremely happy with my TMZ/SBC clutch all summer. Pedal is fairly heavy, but engagement is smooth and there is zero drag.

 

[rdomeck]

Man, I should read what I write before I post....I had the FLYWHEEL machined. The pressure plate looks great as well as the disc. I just hate to replace something if it's not bad. I'm thinking of putting things back together with what I have and see how things feel. The flywheel was really warped as if it had been machine wrong in the past. One side was .610 and the other was .618 I know .008" isn't much, but it's still crooked.

 

[rdomeck]

Still having disengagement issues......I was adjusting the rod at the pedal out of the master and checking to make sure I could still push the slave in and once I hit the point of not being able to push the slave any more I backed it out to where I could.

That left me with a really low pedal and a lot of free play. And I could not get the car in gear while running. I adjusted the rod back into the master and got a much better pedal feel, but still not disengaging.

The other thing I noticed is that my snout for the throw out bearing is about an 1/4" shorter than it should be. I noticed this because the end looked like it has been broken off. I measured one of my other transmissions. Don't think that has anything to do with my problem.

I guess my next step is to replace the clutch assembly....It's the only thing left. And yes I did check my clutch pedal again and there is absolutely no play in it!!!

I see a lot of guy's have issue's with the ACT's and some that don't. Any recommendations? Don't think I'll ever see over 400hp with this car.

 

[DynastyLCD]

when you look at the transmission, where exactly does the clutch fork sit? can you take a pic?

 

[rdomeck]

The clutch fork is to the left of center. Meaning to the drivers side...... I did shim the pivot ball! I'll see if I can snap a pic in the morning.

 

[Jason G.]

A new fork and pivot ball and you still shimmed it?

 

[kartorium]

Can you hear any noise (with motor not running), any noise whatsoever when you press the clutch pedal in?

 

[rdomeck]

No, noise at all......And yes I still shimmed it. Just trying to get this thing doing what it should...

 

[kartorium]

Just checking. I had some serious issues when the frame of my pedal assembly cracked, which caused excessive flexing and twisting with the heavy clutch, and also caused the whole firewall to deflect. The clutch pedal and the mechanisms were all fine, but everything was flexing so much that no matter how you adjusted the clutch or replaced every part, it would still have disengagement issues.

Also, I do realize you said the pedal assembly is fine. This particular problem with the assembly just might not be super obvious when checking over everything, so I thought I would bring it up.