Clutch issue??? I am assuming...I am hoping...

[manikbastrd]

Hey guys,
I have been driving 504 around after picking her up this weekend, and am trying to figure out the clutch issue. I know there are a lot of possibilities so let me get down to it.

Symptoms include:
Clutch pedal engagement at or within an inch or two of the floor
Rough downshifts to second gear, Upshifts are no problem, however it wants to get notchy and grind on the way down. (no other gears have this problem)
hit or miss engagement of Reverse

Car has had an OEM clutch within the last 4,000 miles and the P.O. was an older gentleman so I don't think that the clutch is blown out yet...

My thoughts:
Check if the pedal has been adjusted or not
Check out the interior side of the master cylinder for leaks
Check the Slave cylinder for leaks
Check how much engagement I am getting from the clutch fork pivot. (does anyone have a measurable value for that???)

Solutions:
Adjust the pedal if I can
Clutch master
Clutch Slave
Rebuild petal assembly from JNZ
Stainless clutch line
Longer rod
Replace the Clutch fork

Any other thoughts would be very helpful, and trust me I did a bunch of searching and didn't find anything that mirrored my symptoms very well.
Thanks in advance!!!
-Manik

 

[mitsuturbo]

Maybe this is related to your other tech post and your clutch has tossed some material off the disc, thus becoming grossly out of balance. Or worse... a pressure plate bolt (or more than one) has come loose. I've seen threads break loose on fidanza flywheels and cause nasty vibrations as well as (obviously) clutch issues.

Just a thought.

 

[manikbastrd]

That is a great point. Like I said, I will be doing some checking this afternoon when I can finally get her into my Garage... hopefully this will shed some light on the situation...I would be very surprised if a clutch kit on a bone stock car with

 

[manikbastrd]

Well that certainly looks like a problem...

 

[GSTwithPSI]

Is the boot wet? It's hard to tell. How much adjustment is left in the push rod?

 

[manikbastrd]

I didn't have much time to look at it since I was just on my lunch break. I will be adjusting it out when I get home.

Yes, the boot appeared to be wet. I am going to go ahead and get a new Master ASAP. I still have to check out the slave cyl when I get home.

 

[GSTwithPSI]

Well, hopefully you don't have to do a pedal rebuild. I'd rather pull the motor then do that again.

 

[manikbastrd]

So I just looked and the Pedal is adjusted all the way out, upon closer inspection I noticed that the clutch master does not appear to be leaking and the slave does not appear to be leaking. The pedal does not feel loose, or anything weird...I am a little more stumped than when i started now...I know that it had a new clutch kit 3K ago, and that 20k ago, it got a new clutch master and slave. I suppose they could have gone out. Any other suggestions from anyone??? Anyone had any experience or good results from any specific product?

 

[DynastyLCD]

Make sure all the bolts holding the transmission to the block are tight. Make sure the bolt that goes through the back of the block into the transmission is there... And it's tight.

I would also check the clutch pedal assembly for play. Don't let Brett scare you, it sucks but it's not that bad. Just don't be scared to take things apart.

 

[coyotes]

Check fluid level in transmission?

Sounds like clutch line may need to be bled. If its all new perhaps the bleed was done improperly.

All the difficulty shifting would revolve around this.

 

[manikbastrd]

I just bled the clutch fluid. Is the line known to go bad? Maybe the line is over-stretching and this is causing not enough fluid volume to the slave cylinder....? After bleeding it, the second gear downshift and revers felt a tad better, but not where it should be. second was still notchy. Hmmmm...

 

[EfiniX]

My shifting got much better after I drained out the tranny fluid the last owner put in (Redline judging by the color) and replaced it with Mitsubishi diaqueen. The old fluid came out with a telltale synchro shimer, so I know I'm going to be due for a rebuild when it comes time to get a new clutch.

Like seriously, you wouldn't believe how much better my shifting got after that fluid change. I also put in Redline Heavy in the diff and transfer case (if memory serves).

If you do get curious about this route, do a search to answer your questions about transmission fluid selection. It's almost a religious discussion, with people swearing by different brands and combinations of different fluids and the right ratios for those combinations, etc....

 

[EHmotorsports]

Quoting manikbastrd:
I just bled the clutch fluid. Is the line known to go bad? Maybe the line is over-stretching and this is causing not enough fluid volume to the slave cylinder....? After bleeding it, the second gear downshift and revers felt a tad better, but not where it should be. second was still notchy. Hmmmm...



If you can have a friend inspect how far the clutch fork is traveling when the clutch is pressed in.

from RRE's website
click link to the site

 

[manikbastrd]

The clutch fork on the outside portion of the transmission is not hitting the edge of the bell housing, I didn't feel any slop in the pedal assembly, but I know that they can get worse and worse as time goes on, so I will do a more thorough examination of the pedal assembly. Like i previously stated, I bled the clutch and had a little improvement, however it actually got worse again after driving it around the block. I plan to look at it a little more thoroughly...gahhh this is so annoying...brings back memories of my old galant.

 

[manikbastrd]

Quoting EHmotorsports:

If you can have a friend inspect how far the clutch fork is traveling when the clutch is pressed in.

from RRE's website
click link to the site




If I am reading RRE's tech article correctly, is it recommending shimming the point between the clutch slave rod and the clutch fork? I am going to go back and look to see where it is sitting when there is no clutch pressure applied. On a second note, I noticed that the fluid was pretty gross when changing it out. I am thinking that perhaps the rubber clutch line is starting to give out and that maybe I should try a stainless line instead.

 

[manikbastrd]

Quoting EfiniX:
My shifting got much better after I drained out the tranny fluid the last owner put in (Redline judging by the color) and replaced it with Mitsubishi diaqueen. The old fluid came out with a telltale synchro shimer, so I know I'm going to be due for a rebuild when it comes time to get a new clutch.

Like seriously, you wouldn't believe how much better my shifting got after that fluid change. I also put in Redline Heavy in the diff and transfer case (if memory serves).

If you do get curious about this route, do a search to answer your questions about transmission fluid selection. It's almost a religious discussion, with people swearing by different brands and combinations of different fluids and the right ratios for those combinations, etc....



Unfortunately, the guy had it serviced at a shop that put GL-5 in it I believe...Not excited about that, but I will be replacing it soon enough.

When you check for slop in the pedal does it matter if you are adjusted in or out on the pedal adjuster???

Update.

I bled the Clutch a lot, put an entire bottle of fluid through it and was getting almost continuous bubbles coming through. I think I have a problem with one of the seals in the slave or something. The master doesn't appear to be leaking, and the slave didn't look like it either, however I think I have a problem somewhere. I think I will put a master and a slave in it as soon as I can get them just in case.

I ordered a stock Master Cylinder, but does anyone have a recommendation for the slave cylinder? They didn't have one for a july 1991 model according to Autozone, so I ordered a 1g Slave cyl...hopefully that is the smaller diameter model.

Anyone else got any good ideas???
Thanks in advance

 

[paul j]

Mine engaged very close to the floor and master & slave did not leak. Replaced slave and it went up to more normal engagement. Later replaced master for good measure. I now see my upper slave rubber hose is cracked and looking bad.

 

[manikbastrd]

Good to know...I ordered OEM Mitsu M/C and S/C as well as a stainless line to eliminate(hopefully) any source of bad Juju

 

[G]

Order a speed bleeder for the slave. It makes bleeding virtually impossible to screw up.

 

[paul j]

Does the slave take a M10 speed bleeder like the brakes do per JNZ?