presterone
Well-known member
Kind of worries aboun22 psi on the track with stock internals. I guess it will show me the limits of what the engine could take. It will be a learning experience.
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Bad luck leaves me paranoid
- Thread starter presterone
- Start date
BadVr4
Well-known member
do a tial 38mm external, then switch to a full 3" downpipe. set the boost to 20-22psi and re-tune it.
DynastyLCD
Well-known member
Quoting presterone:
Kind of worries aboun22 psi on the track with stock internals. I guess it will show me the limits of what the engine could take. It will be a learning experience.
stock engines are wonderful things. many of us have made stupid power on the stock 6 bolt 4G63. personally, i've made over 400 AWHP on stock rods, pistons, crank, head. my only changes, were re-ringing the stock pistons to re-fresh them, new bearings, balance shaft delete, 272 cams, ARP head studs and an MLS head gasket. i daily drove multiple stock blocks with 30+ PSI through a 30r. look at turbofonz, 10's on the stock block. wop uses a 3052 making good power on a stock block. many of us are on that road now with zero issues.
if you have DSMlink, you can set your check engine light to go off at a certain knock point. i set mine to 1 count of knock. tune for zero counts of knock, and you'll be safe. then when you're hammering on it, and you see the CEL light up, you get out of it before you cause any damage.
Kind of worries aboun22 psi on the track with stock internals. I guess it will show me the limits of what the engine could take. It will be a learning experience.
stock engines are wonderful things. many of us have made stupid power on the stock 6 bolt 4G63. personally, i've made over 400 AWHP on stock rods, pistons, crank, head. my only changes, were re-ringing the stock pistons to re-fresh them, new bearings, balance shaft delete, 272 cams, ARP head studs and an MLS head gasket. i daily drove multiple stock blocks with 30+ PSI through a 30r. look at turbofonz, 10's on the stock block. wop uses a 3052 making good power on a stock block. many of us are on that road now with zero issues.
if you have DSMlink, you can set your check engine light to go off at a certain knock point. i set mine to 1 count of knock. tune for zero counts of knock, and you'll be safe. then when you're hammering on it, and you see the CEL light up, you get out of it before you cause any damage.
MellowVR4
Well-known member
Do the washer trick on the wastegate /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif worked for me
CutlassJim
Well-known member
If Im think of the same washer trick it won't work. Hes having the inverse of that problem.
MellowVR4
Well-known member
oh, i see
matt92vr4
Well-known member
The peak number looks OK but the graph looks terrible. Are you saying that you cannot go WOT?
presterone
Well-known member
Yes you cannot go wot. For long without boosting to the moon. The graph is terrible but its a baseline.
turbowop
Well-known member
Quoting DynastyLCD:
Quoting presterone:
Kind of worries aboun22 psi on the track with stock internals. I guess it will show me the limits of what the engine could take. It will be a learning experience.
stock engines are wonderful things. many of us have made stupid power on the stock 6 bolt 4G63. personally, i've made over 400 AWHP on stock rods, pistons, crank, head. my only changes, were re-ringing the stock pistons to re-fresh them, new bearings, balance shaft delete, 272 cams, ARP head studs and an MLS head gasket. i daily drove multiple stock blocks with 30+ PSI through a 30r. look at turbofonz, 10's on the stock block. wop uses a 3052 making good power on a stock block. many of us are on that road now with zero issues.
if you have DSMlink, you can set your check engine light to go off at a certain knock point. i set mine to 1 count of knock. tune for zero counts of knock, and you'll be safe. then when you're hammering on it, and you see the CEL light up, you get out of it before you cause any damage.
QFT. I'm not even sure why half the guys on this site do engine builds. Unless you plan to make 500+ WHP, it's just not needed. Stock Mitsu built bottom ends are probably one of the most reliable things on these cars.
Quoting presterone:
Kind of worries aboun22 psi on the track with stock internals. I guess it will show me the limits of what the engine could take. It will be a learning experience.
stock engines are wonderful things. many of us have made stupid power on the stock 6 bolt 4G63. personally, i've made over 400 AWHP on stock rods, pistons, crank, head. my only changes, were re-ringing the stock pistons to re-fresh them, new bearings, balance shaft delete, 272 cams, ARP head studs and an MLS head gasket. i daily drove multiple stock blocks with 30+ PSI through a 30r. look at turbofonz, 10's on the stock block. wop uses a 3052 making good power on a stock block. many of us are on that road now with zero issues.
if you have DSMlink, you can set your check engine light to go off at a certain knock point. i set mine to 1 count of knock. tune for zero counts of knock, and you'll be safe. then when you're hammering on it, and you see the CEL light up, you get out of it before you cause any damage.
QFT. I'm not even sure why half the guys on this site do engine builds. Unless you plan to make 500+ WHP, it's just not needed. Stock Mitsu built bottom ends are probably one of the most reliable things on these cars.
fuel
Well-known member
Yes the stock 4G63 6-bolt sure is one tough motor, the main thing which ultimately kills them is incorrect fuel mix melting pistons/cracking ring lands or timing belts breaking.
My SOHC 8V 4G63 turbo with the primitive ECI throttle body injection was always happy to run 16-20psi through it without many complaints.
My SOHC 8V 4G63 turbo with the primitive ECI throttle body injection was always happy to run 16-20psi through it without many complaints.
matt92vr4
Well-known member
Did they have a boost sensor hooked up? Were you logging the boost and throttle position? I don't think it should creep like that.
DynastyLCD
Well-known member
Quoting turbowop:
QFT. I'm not even sure why half the guys on this site do engine builds. Unless you plan to make 500+ WHP, it's just not needed. Stock Mitsu built bottom ends are probably one of the most reliable things on these cars.
i lol when i see people running an Evo 3 and a forged bottom end, dual valvesprings, 280's, etc... even for "break-in"
sometimes, i look at how capable my setup has been with the stock bottom end, and i wonder if finishing my forged 2.0 bottom end or my 2.3 setup is even worth the money it would take. even with 9.0:1 in both setups, i feel like it'll be a letdown when its not the big power gain i'd hoped for.
OP, the other thing i forgot to mention, be it they are a shop the end message is the same... Ostar went 9.30's on a stock bottom end. they went over 600 HP with that setup. Mike Rizzotti went 9.98 on a stock bottom end. and i got about 50k of BAD abuse out of a stock bottom end i threw together with used parts i had laying around. besides the new rings, and bearings, everything else was used. and it took 30+ PSI for about 50k. and it was a rough 50k... end result, one of the pistons had the ring lands fall apart as i pulled the pistons out, and two others had cracked lands.
end rant. im a stock block believer. it sure as hell takes my abuse /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/devil.gif
QFT. I'm not even sure why half the guys on this site do engine builds. Unless you plan to make 500+ WHP, it's just not needed. Stock Mitsu built bottom ends are probably one of the most reliable things on these cars.
i lol when i see people running an Evo 3 and a forged bottom end, dual valvesprings, 280's, etc... even for "break-in"
sometimes, i look at how capable my setup has been with the stock bottom end, and i wonder if finishing my forged 2.0 bottom end or my 2.3 setup is even worth the money it would take. even with 9.0:1 in both setups, i feel like it'll be a letdown when its not the big power gain i'd hoped for.
OP, the other thing i forgot to mention, be it they are a shop the end message is the same... Ostar went 9.30's on a stock bottom end. they went over 600 HP with that setup. Mike Rizzotti went 9.98 on a stock bottom end. and i got about 50k of BAD abuse out of a stock bottom end i threw together with used parts i had laying around. besides the new rings, and bearings, everything else was used. and it took 30+ PSI for about 50k. and it was a rough 50k... end result, one of the pistons had the ring lands fall apart as i pulled the pistons out, and two others had cracked lands.
end rant. im a stock block believer. it sure as hell takes my abuse /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/devil.gif
turbowop
Well-known member
My stock bottom end has seen countless dragstrip passes since about '01. One burned valve in '03, two melted spark plugs tuning meth for my first time on Maftpro in '06 (preigntion at torque peak, didnt even register on the knock sensor)and one melted plug on the first pass I made after the dyno tune at English llast summer. Knock went through the roof quick about 3/4 of the way through fourth. I had to really change AFR's and timing to make a clean pass through all the gears. I guess the street tune required way different fueling/timing compared to the dyno.
I'm not sure how it's still together, but it is, and compression is still near 150psi across all cylinders. And since this is just my "fun car", it sees WOT pretty much every time it comes out of the garage. If I ever blow this motor, I'll probably throw another stock bottom end back into it.
I'm not sure how it's still together, but it is, and compression is still near 150psi across all cylinders. And since this is just my "fun car", it sees WOT pretty much every time it comes out of the garage. If I ever blow this motor, I'll probably throw another stock bottom end back into it.
prove_it
Well-known member
^agree with wop. Stock bottom end is super tough. Only thing is that a lot of engines are running up into the 150k mark, which in my opinion is time to freshen up the engine.
I only built my bottom end because I needed new rods and pistons anyway. I got a huge hook up on new eagle/wiseco combo. Cost me about 100 bucks more than stock internals. Lighter rods and more compression was worth it, IMO.
I only built my bottom end because I needed new rods and pistons anyway. I got a huge hook up on new eagle/wiseco combo. Cost me about 100 bucks more than stock internals. Lighter rods and more compression was worth it, IMO.
James
Well-known member
I'm 300+ on stock bottom end. I push it hard and the car loves it.
5OF2k
Well-known member
Quoting prove_it:
^agree with wop. Stock bottom end is super tough. Only thing is that a lot of engines are running up into the 150k mark, which in my opinion is time to freshen up the engine.
I only built my bottom end because I needed new rods and pistons anyway. I got a huge hook up on new eagle/wiseco combo. Cost me about 100 bucks more than stock internals. Lighter rods and more compression was worth it, IMO.
Stock bottom end here. E316g at 27lbs made 365 here in CO. Now im using a Full-Race/Garrett T67 and will easily be running over 20psi on that(provided the 950s will suffice) and getting as close to 500 as possible. I have no idea how many miles are on the bottom end, but its definitely been rebuilt at some point with the bshafts being removed and a MLS HG put in and headstuds. My car is also a DD, by the way and has 18x,xxx on the chassis.
Point being, as everyone said the stock blocks are very reliable and very strong given a good, clean tune and healthy engine.
-Jake
^agree with wop. Stock bottom end is super tough. Only thing is that a lot of engines are running up into the 150k mark, which in my opinion is time to freshen up the engine.
I only built my bottom end because I needed new rods and pistons anyway. I got a huge hook up on new eagle/wiseco combo. Cost me about 100 bucks more than stock internals. Lighter rods and more compression was worth it, IMO.
Stock bottom end here. E316g at 27lbs made 365 here in CO. Now im using a Full-Race/Garrett T67 and will easily be running over 20psi on that(provided the 950s will suffice) and getting as close to 500 as possible. I have no idea how many miles are on the bottom end, but its definitely been rebuilt at some point with the bshafts being removed and a MLS HG put in and headstuds. My car is also a DD, by the way and has 18x,xxx on the chassis.
Point being, as everyone said the stock blocks are very reliable and very strong given a good, clean tune and healthy engine.
-Jake
presterone
Well-known member
Quoting matt92vr4:
Did they have a boost sensor hooked up? Were you logging the boost and throttle position? I don't think it should creep like that.
They did not log boost for the dyno he was using my laptop to tune, I have a zietronix data logger with the LCD display behind my steering wheel. He didn't use my logger which I thought was weird, he just watched the display and logged RPM, AFR and different temps. I found tonight the turbo inlet pipe came loose and my it was sitting on top of the line to the wastegate, pinching the line closed. I got all excited thinking it wouldn't creep but it still does the same thing. I need to port the wastegate hole.
Did they have a boost sensor hooked up? Were you logging the boost and throttle position? I don't think it should creep like that.
They did not log boost for the dyno he was using my laptop to tune, I have a zietronix data logger with the LCD display behind my steering wheel. He didn't use my logger which I thought was weird, he just watched the display and logged RPM, AFR and different temps. I found tonight the turbo inlet pipe came loose and my it was sitting on top of the line to the wastegate, pinching the line closed. I got all excited thinking it wouldn't creep but it still does the same thing. I need to port the wastegate hole.
