What Ryan is saying is that the rear DSM subframe is not really substantially different, and will work fine if you remove the rear rack, etc.
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4WS with 4 Bolt diff
- Thread starter 89Patches
- Start date
Quoting prove_it:
4 Bolt axles in the states indicate a rear lsd is installed.
That is not 100 % true. I believe Eclipses were 100% lsd, but not Talons. Or maybe vice-versa, I will have to check.
4 Bolt axles in the states indicate a rear lsd is installed.
That is not 100 % true. I believe Eclipses were 100% lsd, but not Talons. Or maybe vice-versa, I will have to check.
Last edited:
GSTwithPSI
Well-known member
Quoting iceman69510:
What Ryan is saying is that the rear DSM subframe is not really substantially different, and will work fine if you remove the rear rack, etc.
To me, it doesn't make sense to drop the subframe and remove everything just to reinstall it. If I'm going to do the work to drop the subframe, I'm going to replace it. Why deal with fixing the rear trailing arms on the VR4 subframe, removing the rack, blocking lines and all that bullshit? 1 for 1 swap and be done is the way to go IMO.
What Ryan is saying is that the rear DSM subframe is not really substantially different, and will work fine if you remove the rear rack, etc.
To me, it doesn't make sense to drop the subframe and remove everything just to reinstall it. If I'm going to do the work to drop the subframe, I'm going to replace it. Why deal with fixing the rear trailing arms on the VR4 subframe, removing the rack, blocking lines and all that bullshit? 1 for 1 swap and be done is the way to go IMO.
I understand your point, and I often do things that way just for expediency. What I am saying and Ryan is too, is that there is nothing different. Even the trailing arms are not. They are just active on a VR4 and passive on a 1g.
I have removed a 4ws system completely (without actually removing the crossmember from the car). Actions such as blocking off lines or removing lines are the same regardless of whether you replace the crossmember or not if you are disabling/removing the 4ws. Easier out of the car of course if doing a complete exchange.
I have removed a 4ws system completely (without actually removing the crossmember from the car). Actions such as blocking off lines or removing lines are the same regardless of whether you replace the crossmember or not if you are disabling/removing the 4ws. Easier out of the car of course if doing a complete exchange.
Quoting prove_it:
4 Bolt axles in the states indicate a rear lsd is installed. Not 100% positive, but you might already have LSD. Check the rear diff cover for the service sticker. That will indicate.
As for LSD options, being that your in Europe, you can swap any year EVO rear diff carrier into the pumpkin. There are a few write-ups on how to do this. Internally the dimensions are the same. In the states we can use the Eclipse/Talon rear Viscous carrier with 4ws drive gear installed. Also I know several that have used the Evo 8 rear mechanical rear diff carrier, but not sure if the 4WS drive gear fits with that set-up.
Yeah, at least my service sticker indicates it's a non-lsd rear.
Ok so if we think as simple as possible:
-I buy a (early?) Evo rear diff carrier
-Open both old a new
-Install 4ws drive gear to evo diff
-Drive hard?
Evo's here around thats being parted are mostly from 4 to 9, but most of them are with AYC rear, so I should find RS versions without AYC.
4 Bolt axles in the states indicate a rear lsd is installed. Not 100% positive, but you might already have LSD. Check the rear diff cover for the service sticker. That will indicate.
As for LSD options, being that your in Europe, you can swap any year EVO rear diff carrier into the pumpkin. There are a few write-ups on how to do this. Internally the dimensions are the same. In the states we can use the Eclipse/Talon rear Viscous carrier with 4ws drive gear installed. Also I know several that have used the Evo 8 rear mechanical rear diff carrier, but not sure if the 4WS drive gear fits with that set-up.
Yeah, at least my service sticker indicates it's a non-lsd rear.
Ok so if we think as simple as possible:
-I buy a (early?) Evo rear diff carrier
-Open both old a new
-Install 4ws drive gear to evo diff
-Drive hard?
Evo's here around thats being parted are mostly from 4 to 9, but most of them are with AYC rear, so I should find RS versions without AYC.
89Patches
Well-known member
The Evo LSD carrier won't work with the 4WS drive gear.
fuel
Well-known member
Quoting dandanger:
Reviving old topic..
So, as mentioned above, I stand corrected about the rear in my car, it's a 4-bolt with 4ws(got under my car cause it's under work now).
Question is, what are my options for rear lsd if I want to retain 4ws? Since every aftermarket manufacturer catalog i've searched gives absolutely nothing for my car I got to take it from somewhere else, or maybe someone could point to a different models lsd which would 100% sure fit.
You will need to find a viscous LSD from an Evolution VR-4 (JDM), or ditch the 4WS and go plate type LSD. Unfortunately you can't have a plate type LSD with 4WS as the plate LSD centre is far larger and takes up room where the 4WS drive gear would be. I'm considering fitting a plate LSD to mine, but retain the 4WD by coupling a speed sensitive electric motor to the diff driven pump. This way I could vary the speed it kicks in and the amount of assist.
Reviving old topic..
So, as mentioned above, I stand corrected about the rear in my car, it's a 4-bolt with 4ws(got under my car cause it's under work now).
Question is, what are my options for rear lsd if I want to retain 4ws? Since every aftermarket manufacturer catalog i've searched gives absolutely nothing for my car I got to take it from somewhere else, or maybe someone could point to a different models lsd which would 100% sure fit.
You will need to find a viscous LSD from an Evolution VR-4 (JDM), or ditch the 4WS and go plate type LSD. Unfortunately you can't have a plate type LSD with 4WS as the plate LSD centre is far larger and takes up room where the 4WS drive gear would be. I'm considering fitting a plate LSD to mine, but retain the 4WD by coupling a speed sensitive electric motor to the diff driven pump. This way I could vary the speed it kicks in and the amount of assist.
r4pt0x
Well-known member
Quote:
I'm considering fitting a plate LSD to mine, but retain the 4WD by coupling a speed sensitive electric motor to the diff driven pump. This way I could vary the speed it kicks in and the amount of assist.
This exact setup was used on the group A rally cars at the "final evolution" version of the galant. (already fitted with active center diff!)
I also thought about putting the rear ABS sensors to a better use by feeding their signals to a small Atmel (even an ATTiny should easily do the job...), using speed and wheel speed difference to regulate the pump (maybe with a pressure sensor as feedback). But as I'm using the viscous LSD and deleted the ABS completely, including all sensors, i'm keeping the default diff-driven pump setup...
I'm considering fitting a plate LSD to mine, but retain the 4WD by coupling a speed sensitive electric motor to the diff driven pump. This way I could vary the speed it kicks in and the amount of assist.
This exact setup was used on the group A rally cars at the "final evolution" version of the galant. (already fitted with active center diff!)
I also thought about putting the rear ABS sensors to a better use by feeding their signals to a small Atmel (even an ATTiny should easily do the job...), using speed and wheel speed difference to regulate the pump (maybe with a pressure sensor as feedback). But as I'm using the viscous LSD and deleted the ABS completely, including all sensors, i'm keeping the default diff-driven pump setup...
