1g vs 2g auto trans

[VR_IV_MR]

I'm looking to purchase an automatic dsm so that I can part it out and keep some stuff and sell the rest. I want to swap the galant over to an automatic. I understand that the only difference between a 1g and a 2g automatic is the lockup converter. The only reason I have found that the lockup converter is better than the 1g autos is lower rpms and better gas mileage on the highway- something I wouldn't mind having. However, I have read threads about the issues with putting a 2g auto trans into a 1g dsm. The particular issues that seem to be a main concern is clearing/modifying the frame rails and the mounts, and the axles. Would the same problems be encountered with putting a 2g auto trans into the galant? I am pretty sure I would have to use a 2g auto intermediate and 2g auto passenger side axle.

What also confuses me is that on the driveshaft shop website, they don't differentiate between automatic and manual axles. There is only this: click

So what do you guys think, is it worth the extra trouble to go with the 2g auto just for the lockup converter?

 

[fuel]

Am pretty sure auto and manual axles are the same spline size/count and length. Outer CV joints would be the same anyway.

I also would have thought the 1G and 2G casings would be identical size given they are both W5A33 transmissions. 6G Galant auto definitely has a lock up torque converter so would expect a 1G and 2G to have one also?

 

[EMX5636]

I know a buddy of mine is building a drag 1G DSM using a 2G auto trans and he had to notch out the pass side framerail noticeably (possibly the k-member as well). I'm not sure how this relates to the Galant, and if it's a 1G vs. 2G auto thing, or factory 5-speed vs. Auto framerail thing. I'll ask him today when he get's out of work, I know he researched it a lot before deciding to do the 2G trans.

 

[Boost4U]

Quoting fuel:
Am pretty sure auto and manual axles are the same spline size/count and length. Outer CV joints would be the same anyway.

I also would have thought the 1G and 2G casings would be identical size given they are both W5A33 transmissions. 6G Galant auto definitely has a lock up torque converter so would expect a 1G and 2G to have one also?


The axles are the same, I used 5 speed axles in my swap. The 1g does not have the lockup converter. I can't comment as far as the size of the 2g trans but I do believe that it is bigger.

 

[VR_IV_MR]

yeah ive gone through a load of threads on tuners about all kinds of swaps, just not necessarily the 2g auto into the galant. I know it will still be possible I was just hoping someone would've been like "oh yeah the galant install is actually easier than putting it into the 1g (not having to modify frame rails lol)"

I've seen a couple of auto vr4s but they all seem to be 1g autos.



ok so yeah auto/manual axles are the same but the 1g and 2g axles are different. and since I am using a 2g trans, wouldn't I have to use 2g axles, at least in the front?

 

[Boost4U]

it would probably come down to the difference in the width of the 1g and 2g, not sure if there's a difference.

 

[VR_IV_MR]

I am also confused about the rear diff. If I were to buy this 97 TSi AWD automatic on craigslist, I would need to swap the trans, transfer case, engine harness, and rear diff? What if the rear diff is a 3 bolt? Can I use my 4 bolt rear that I have now and just use the internals of the 2g so that the gear ratio is correct? Or do I have to find a 4 bolt rear from a 2g automatic in order to have a 4 bolt with the correct gear ratio?

 

[fuel]

Factory 6G Galant VR-4 automatics definitely have a lock up torque converter, unsure why the 1G DSM didn't get the lock up torque converter considering they are basically a coupe version of the 6G Galant platform.

Difference in driveshafts between 1G and 2G would be width because they cars are different widths and the placements of the hubs may be in a different place given the 2G has multi link suspension compared to the 1G's macpherson strut.

If you are using a 2G trans in a 6G VR-4 or 1G DSM I would use the 1G shafts or the GVR-4 shafts - they should still fit into the 2G trans.

You need to have a rear diff ratio which matches the transmission/transfer case combo. You could swap the trans/transfer case and engine harness from the 2G but you would need a 1G rear diff housing at least to put the 2G rear diff 3.307 ratio gears into.

 

[EMX5636]

Quoting VR_IV_MR:
I am also confused about the rear diff. If I were to buy this 97 TSi AWD automatic on craigslist, I would need to swap the trans, transfer case, engine harness, and rear diff? What if the rear diff is a 3 bolt? Can I use my 4 bolt rear that I have now and just use the internals of the 2g so that the gear ratio is correct? Or do I have to find a 4 bolt rear from a 2g automatic in order to have a 4 bolt with the correct gear ratio?



Fuel is correct. You cannot use the 2G assembly. It doesn't have 3 or 4 bolts, it's a totally different setup. Plus it won't bolt into a 1G/GVR4. Just take the ring gear/pinion out (I actually don't know if the pinion will work, but I think it should) and swap it into your diff.

Engine harness might be a PITA, since it's OBD2. Probably better off finding a 1G Auto AWD donor and then sourcing a 2G trans if you want one.

 

[VR_IV_MR]

I am going to call up shops such as IPT and TRE just to confirm everything, I just wanted to have a general idea of this stuff so I didn't sound like a complete idiot, lol.


-Ok so then I would just swap the ring gear/pinion into my 4 bolt lsd rear and be able to still use my rear axles?

-I only said engine harness because thats what I saw people do in other threads. Would it be too much to switch it all over to OBD2? I could use the obd2 engine harness, a 2g ecu, and then just hook up any extra sensors the obd2 has? what are the extra sensors? I guess I would have to talk to ECMTuning to swap my galantvr4 chip out for a 2g chip as well? This is off topic, just throwing the idea out there lol... I will look up these answers later today.



-Ok so to make it work I would need the 2g trans, 2g transfer case, 2g ring gear/pinion swap into my rear lsd. I would keep my driveshaft and my rear axles, what about my front axles? Would I need 2g front axles since the trans is a different length?

 

[DynastyLCD]

as far as the OBD2 part is concerned, to compare the two: swapping over to a 1g auto harness = practically plug and play. 2g auto harness = rewire everything. i don't see any real gain or benefit, especially with link V3's support for a 1g ECU.

OP: it would be much easier and simpler of a swap if you could source a 95/96 auto car. you could swap in a 1g auto 4 bolt LSD, and use the trans/tcase that comes with the car... if it's the same way the manual transmissions were designed. technically, a GVR4 could use a manual trans from 91-96, but the 97-99 have a different rear ring & pinion ratio. that being said, if auto took the same path, a 95/96 car would squash a LOT of your headaches.

 

[VR_IV_MR]

Interesting. So 95/96 trans and tcase and harness. Then a 1g auto 4 bolt rear.. cant i just use my manual 4 bolt and put in the auto gear/pinion as was mentioned before?

What about the front axles?. If it came down to it i could order custom from DSS.

 

[Mark]

Will also need a TCU or shifter box (easier way).

The swap is lot of work but it's fun/different when its done.

 

[DynastyLCD]

Quoting VR_IV_MR:
Interesting. So 95/96 trans and tcase and harness. Then a 1g auto 4 bolt rear.. cant i just use my manual 4 bolt and put in the auto gear/pinion as was mentioned before?



you could. or you could just buy the auto 4 bolt LSD, then sell your 5 speed rear end instead of hacking up two diff's for one. take money from 5 speed rear end to cover costs of the auto 4 bolt.

4 bolt's aren't getting any easier to find. doing that will do another guy a favor down the road when he gets the rear diff he's needed forever. everyone's happy /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[VR_IV_MR]

Quote:

OP: it would be much easier and simpler of a swap if you could source a 95/96 auto car. you could swap in a 1g auto 4 bolt LSD, and use the trans/tcase that comes with the car... if it's the same way the manual transmissions were designed. technically, a GVR4 could use a manual trans from 91-96, but the 97-99 have a different rear ring & pinion ratio. that being said, if auto took the same path, a 95/96 car would squash a LOT of your headaches.




can anyone confirm this part that is in bold? No disrespect dynasty, its just that you said you weren't sure /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[rexwagon1909]

I am in the process of swapping a 2g auto into my Galant. If you are still doing the swap and have any questions I can try and steer you in the right direction. My buddy did a 2g auto swap in his 91 talon and now into a 92 Mirage evo 3 clone. Let me know if I can help

 

[VR_IV_MR]

this is crazy. I haven't thought about this swap since my last post in this thread which was last September. I thought of checking this thread today just to refresh my memory on the topic, and oddly enough you posted your reply three days ago... how weird... anyways...


Rex, did you source all the parts separately or did you buy an auto car to source everything from? What are you doing about the rear diff? What front/rear axles are you using? please be as specific as possible because I am not too mechanically inclined, the only information I know is what I research on this forum and dsmtuners. Do I have to get a '95 or a '96 like DynastyLCD said, or would the parts work from the later years as well? Are you doing a TCU or a shifter box? I don't remember the advantages/disadvantages of the TCU/shifter box, but I am looking for something that would be able to be driven like a normal automatic car. I think that means I would need a TCU, not sure, havent read about this stuff in over 6 months lol.... Thanks for the help

 

[DynastyLCD]

click

it looks like as long as you use a matching trans/t-case, the 1g 4 bolt LSD auto rear end will work. it's the same rear end ratio. that being said, if you have a 2g trans and t-case it should be fine.

i think you would only really run into issues when using a 2g trans with 1g t-case or the other way around. mind you that diagram does not include the 97-99's, which i know for sure have a different rear end ratio. at least in 5 speed world.

hope this helps!

 

[rexwagon1909]

Yes the 1g auto rear will work. The hard part is 2g auto fitment and axles. My friend did this swap in his talon, I am doing this in my 90 Galant GSX. You need the kiggly 6bolt adapter, 2g starter plate, 2g intermediate shaft, transmission harness, torque converter, transfer case, for axles my friend used 2g driver side and passenger is 89 précis. Make sure that you do not get a jdm 2g auto as they will have fitment issues and one friend had this happen. A usdm toque converter will not fit correctly. Also I would do the kiggly line pressure mod. Depending on level of performance I would do ipt shift kit, end clutches, and kiggly front clutches.

 

[rexwagon1909]

Also I believe speed sensor is different, my friends car modified his 1g sensor to work with 2g