New leak - intermediate shaft seal? Pics inside.

[blacksheep]

Story - I have been working on replacing my oil pan. I jacked the car up yesterday in front and left it on stands with rear wheels sitting on the ground. As I began to take off stuff, I noticed a new drip at the last bolt of the t-case.

So, I assumed it was oil from the pan splashed around. I cleaned it off and went back to work. I left the pan to drain overnight and went to work today. Came back and dafuq is this??? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

Seems to be coming from that t-case bolt area in the pic above. I assumed it was tcase fluid possibly leaking for some reason maybe since the car was jacked up high in the front. But, read on, I am thinking this is tranny fluid... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

I clean up the mess and get to removing the t-case. I pull the t-case off to find this fuggin mess... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif

I am guessing it is the tranny intermediate shaft seal leaking tranny fluid? I am surprised this did not leak before.

1) Is it normal and because the wheel is off the ground and the axle is pulled out somewhat esp since I took the bolts holding the intermediate shaft up?

OR

2) Do I need to replace that damn seal?

If #2 - do I need to undo the axle nut, lower balljoint etc and move hub off so I can pull the axle? Or can I just split the axle at the intermediate shaft and take it off and pull the seal and replace it? Whats the best way to pry off that intermediate shaft?

Any tips on how to do this esp. pulling that intermediate shaft, tranny seal and installing new one? I assume I will need a hooked seal puller to take it off and a big socket and seal to tap it in? I may just drain trans fluid, probably needs replaced anyways.

Thanks all!

 

[turbowop]

Looks like that axle seal has been leaking for awhile now. Pull the shaft and replace it with a new one. Easy peazy. At least you're in there doing other sh*t anyway.

You still happy you came back to GVR4 ownership? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif Get used to stuff like this, and the associated turning of wrenches. These cars are getting ooooold, like us. Replacement of that seal is about as easy as it gets, IMO. You sound so sad in your post about it, but it's really no big deal, dude. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Ultimately, the reason I sold 503 was because of all the maintenance work like this. And it always seemed to be sh*t that required me to be on my back under the car. Every f***ing weekend almost. I got sick of having to deal with it because that car was my "daily driver". With 1051, I don't really care because I can let it sit as long as I want. I'm much happier with a newer vehicle as my daily rig. But I won't ever sell 1051 because I love the thing, no matter how much work it requires. I'm not pushed for time, and that's what makes it tolerable.

 

[blacksheep]

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif I am sad and yes, repressed memories of gvr4 ownership in years gone past is coming back like an uncorked bottle of champagne. Missing the Evo ownership even more...LOL

Worst part is I have been suffering from serious tennis elbow and cannot grip worth a sh*t and hand has been hurting, fingers all numb etc. Its made this pan work hard the last couple of days.

Yeah, strangely there has been no spots on my garage floor since december when I got the car. I drove it around one time and pulled back in to have seized rear calipers, this oil leak and now a trans leak. Grrr....

EDIT - 1051 has been work and you have pretty much built it up from the ground up man. Props to you. With that sort of labor of love for all these years, it would be very hard to get rid of.

 

[turbowop]

The recent axle loosening may have created the wet leak you see on the floor, but the fact remains that all that dirt and grime under the seal means it's been slowly leaking anyway and it needs a new seal. Don't worry about it too much, it's all just part of the fun when it comes to old cars. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif And I know all about pains while working on cars. Like I said, all that work UNDER 503 is what drove me to get something newer. My back, knees, wrists, etc., were screaming at me to get something newer. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif I'm fairly athletic since I ski all winter, and do P90x plyometrics and run during the summer, but I just turned 37. Ugh.

 

[blacksheep]

Damn, I am a couch potato compared to you. I dont work out AT ALL. Nothing. And watch TV in the winters... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif

So, you suggesting to pull whole axle out with intermediate shaft? Or split at the intermediate shaft? Do I need a slidehammer etc or just pry bar? Thanks!

 

[turbowop]

With all the PNW beer I drink, I'd be fat as f*** if I didn't ski and work out. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rofl.gif

Pull the whole thing out as one assembly. Pull the bolts that connect the lower strut to the knuckle and the knuckle will move far enough that you can pull that axle all the way out of the trans and replace the seal.

And that seal is cake because it has a flange that keeps you from pressing it in too deep.

 

[blacksheep]

LOL, I am getting bigger every year - I eat rice like there is a famine coming.

Good to know it cannot be pushed in too far. I read you need to grease it on the inside and outside edges before installing!

I hope that axle nut breaks loose tomorrow with the impact and wheel in the air.

 

[turbowop]

I eat way too much basmati rice and curry from a local place just a couple blocks from my house. The wife and I are addicted. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/yum.gif BUTTER CHICKEN OMFG NOMS

You don't need to grease both sides of the seal on that one. I just smear a VERY LIGHT coat of grey RTV on the metal ring that goes in the trans to help it seal in case the trans housing has a slight scratch/gouge, and then smear some fresh oil on the seal before I insert the axle.

You don't even need to yank the axle nut. Like I said, the knuckle will move far enough to pull the axle out without actually pulling the axle out of the hub. For what it's worth, when I do trans R&R's I don't pull the axle nuts. I leave them in the hubs and let them hang.

 

[blacksheep]

I buy 20 lb bags of basmati from costco every 2 months /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

Cool, I misunderstood before. That should make it easier, yay. I will be trying tonight.

 

[blacksheep]

I ordered seals up from JNZ. Josh said I should probably replace the t-case seal where the output shaft from tranny goes into it. I also ordered some tranny fluid and tcase fluid. I should probably flush them out as I don't know when it was last changed on the car.

 

[turbowop]

Might as well change the fluid in the rear end while you're under there as well.

 

[blacksheep]

Yep, ordered that as well. I told Josh on the phone, I want what Jack Trans recommends only, he got a chuckle... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hsugh.gif

 

[ktmrider]

Quoting blacksheep:
Yep, ordered that as well. I told Josh on the phone, I want what Jack Trans recommends only, he got a chuckle...

I see what you did there... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

[DynastyLCD]

like everyone else said, that seal is cake. i had to do one on my blue 1g, i got to work one morning, and it leaked out enough to leave some basketball sized spots... though the garage was dry when i left. it took me all of 25 minutes working on the ground during my lunch break. so simple to do and with an impact you've got no worries. technically only 16 or 17 bolts/nuts are removed, and you could get away with only jacking up the drivers side.

Quoting turbowop:
You don't even need to yank the axle nut. Like I said, the knuckle will move far enough to pull the axle out without actually pulling the axle out of the hub. For what it's worth, when I do trans R&R's I don't pull the axle nuts. I leave them in the hubs and let them hang.



that's an interesting way to go about it if you ask me. i just don't see the point in working around them i guess. much easier to gun the t-case off with the intermediate shaft and CV axle completely out though. i'm also spoiled with wonderful impact tools which obviously saves me tons of time and effort. i would think that the passenger side axle would be an issue and get in your way. just goes to show you that there's always different ways to do the same job.

 

[blacksheep]

DynastyLCD - I have an impact. I assume I will still have to unbolt the strut your way. I am fine with either as long as I don't have to mess with that 21 year old balljoint on the knuckle. That will suck... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/uhh.gif

I will try Wop's way and see if I have clearance etc. Goal for tonight is get axle out of way, drain tranny fluid and remove old oil pan. Then I wait for the seals, oil pan bolts and fluids to show. Will post updates!

 

[turbowop]

Quoting DynastyLCD:


Quoting turbowop:
You don't even need to yank the axle nut. Like I said, the knuckle will move far enough to pull the axle out without actually pulling the axle out of the hub. For what it's worth, when I do trans R&R's I don't pull the axle nuts. I leave them in the hubs and let them hang.



that's an interesting way to go about it if you ask me. i just don't see the point in working around them i guess. much easier to gun the t-case off with the intermediate shaft and CV axle completely out though. i'm also spoiled with wonderful impact tools which obviously saves me tons of time and effort. i would think that the passenger side axle would be an issue and get in your way. just goes to show you that there's always different ways to do the same job.



I suppose I should clarify. I use zip-ties to hold them out of the way. I don't actually let them just hang. Although I usually pull the xfer case off before I even get to the axles. I just use hand tools, but I've never felt that the intermediate shaft got in the way of removing the bolts. I've pulled the axles during a trans R&R before, but it was usually because I was doing other stuff as well. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dunno.gif

BTW, KC. since you're going to change the fluid in the rear anyway, you might as well get the ass end of the car up in the air now, before you drain the trans. Make sure the car is level so that you drain as much old fluid as possible, and so that when you refill, you get an accurate amount in there. Fill the trans until fluid comes out the fill hole, then seal it up. If the car is kicked back at an angle like it is now, you will actually have to overfill it to get fluid to come out the fill hole.

 

[vr4play]

Quoting blacksheep:
DynastyLCD - I have an impact. I assume I will still have to unbolt the strut your way. I am fine with either as long as I don't have to mess with that 21 year old balljoint on the knuckle. That will suck... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/uhh.gif





I always just pull the nut off the ball joint and separate it from the knuckle. I do enough alignments in a day I don't feel like having to do mine all of the time. I have an air hammer with a flat round that I use and it makes fast work of getting the ball joint loose out of the knuckle without fuffing it up. I also have a fancy tool that can be used for aluminum knuckles cause you don't want to hit on one of those. Just my 2 cents.

 

[turbowop]

I've never once lost my front alignment by separating the knuckle from the strut. Unless you're using concentric bolts, there isn't enough play to change anything a significant amount.

 

[blacksheep]

HOly sh*t - what a night yesterday was. Let me tell y'all how it went down. I went ahead to try it "Wop's way" - But, the lower bolt on the strut mount (not the camber bolt) was rust seized in. I impacted the nut off like buttah. But, I could not turn it at all. I even placed a jack and raised the lower arm to make it parallel to the ground to remove load off it etc. I bent my giant breaker bar trying to get that damn bolt to come out. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif I PB Blasted the sh*t out of it and kept trying with my bent bar. No luck. The whole knuckle part that goes into the strut was frozen solid. I shoved giant breaker bar in there with no luck. I didnt have enough room to get a BFH in to hit that bolt as the caliper was right there. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif

So, I resorted to try and see if I can loosen the axle nut. That thing came off easy with the impact. I cranked the wheel as much as I could and tried to see if I could get the axle out. No luck. I got the axle to slide out of transmission, but did not come out. So, I went back to work on the lower strut mount. I took a flathead and start chipping away at the rust seized areas till I could see a gap. Then more PB Blast. I shoved a giant pry bar between knuckle and strut and got the knuckle to finally move some as it was pivoting on the lower bolt. Did it several several times till I was confident knuckle was moving. I moved it as far back as I could and now I could get the BFH in. Pounded on it for a while. Then back to breaker bar. And I got to start to turn. Did that a few times, put the impact on it and it was out!

At this point, knuckle was free. I dropped it all the way out and pulled the whole axle out as one piece.

I did try to split it at the "jackshaft", but I could not. I saw prior pry bar marks, so someone has been in there before! Anyone know what the trick is split it? Now that I have it on the ground, is there an easier way to do it? Do I need a special tool?

This was a 2 hour ordeal.Damn these old cars! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif

I am going to get the rear in the air tomorrow. I know my driveshaft sounds like a freakin spaceship on decel - WUBBB WUBBB WUBBB WUBBB. Pretty sure it needs carrier bearings or whatever those giant donut bushings are and u-joints. I might as well fix it. I would hesitate selling the car to anyone with it sounding that way, personally.

Tomorrow or weekend, I am going to drop the DS and drain the rear diff. This will get trans level and I will drain rest of it, so thanks so much for that tip, Wop!

I went to walmart late at night (less crazies around, only crackhead types shop that late lol), bought 200 sandwich bags, some sharpie, 2 five gallon totes and cataloged all the bolts I took off. I am all prepared to take off some more stuff like the front and rear subframes, suspension, gas tank etc. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/devil.gif

Wop - The "Blacksheep Trying to be like BobDole" build might just begin, but mine will take years. This weekend will be deciding factor. I almost took the whole knuckle off and lower LCA off.

I did this to the Evo when I prepped it to be a race car and it seemed simpler to work on. The gvr4 I seem to know less about, so everyone be warned for tons of questions! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

EDIT - once I was all done. I pushed the knuckle back into strut and put a bolt in. I didnt want the lower balljoint hanging with that weight.

Also, I have that balljoint seperator tool, looks like a scissor. You slip it on and tighten the nut, till it pushes the BJ out. Scary when it goes, giant bag. I sit far away and turn it facing away like its a bomb about to explode...LOL. Used it on the Evo and s2000 etc. If I pull this crap out, I am replacing it all, so I will butcher it out if need be.

 

[Romanova]

KC,
Ply yourself with liquor and the job will go a lot easier. Take your time and be patient... you'll get it.