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Let's talk FIAV and ISC block off plates!


cheekychimp Galant VR4.org Moderator
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981378 posted 03/31/11 11:07 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I have an aftermarket throttle body but the FIAV and ISC assembly bolts straight onto it. I'm having a couple of idle issues and I want to rebuild that part. Now I know I can get new o-rings/gaskets, a new ISC, new throttle closed switch but what about the FIAV itself. As far as I know it's just a wax plug so if it is faulty can it be replaced or do you have to purchase the entire lower assembly?

I also know there are a number of block off plates around. One that blocks off everything including the ISC and just replaces that entire assembly. Another that goes between the TB and the assembly and retains the ISC function whilst eliminating the FIAV and an EGR block off. Does any one have any info on the benefits and disadvantages of each.

For reference, Hong Kong is a tropical climate so for 10 months of the year or more it really never gets cold. It also means that I have NOT deleted my A/C and I have no plans to do so. With a properly functioning FIAV I get an extremely fast idle at start up when it is warm, which I really don't like.

I'm leaning towards an FIAV block off that retains the ISC (for the A/C) but I just want to find out from those that have gone that route if the car is difficult to start or stalls a lot until it warms up because that would bug me.

I also have a 12v solenoid activated FIAV lying about that I could install on a toggle switch in place of the stock FIAV. The advantage of running that is that I could get some restrictors and play around until I get the correct start up rpm and once I have that done I could run it off a temp switch to make it fully auto.

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89Mirageman
Senior Member


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981385 posted 03/31/11 11:41 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I bypassed the throttle body coolant hoses on my 95 GS-T back in the day and it took the car quite a while to idle down when it was cold outside. I hooked them back up and the problem was gone. I would think that this would be the same thing as eliminating the FIAV.


Edited by 89Mirageman (03/31/11 11:42 PM)

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SouthCaliVR4
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981395 posted 04/01/11 12:24 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Not so, in your case the valve saw cold for a much longer period till the radiant engine heat made it's way to the wax & closed the port.

Paul, You may have to feather the throttle a little when it's cold but not for long.



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ktmrider
Cool Guy Crowd


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981430 posted 04/01/11 08:30 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Paul I did the FIAV block-off and coolant bypass, can't rave enough about it. Rock solid idle both cold and hot including A/C on-off.

No noticable effect on cold-start other than taking a few extra spins of the starter to fire ( but it could be my old injector seals ) even in sub-zero centigrade temps.

Do it!



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vtecds1
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981439 posted 04/01/11 09:00 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
This mod looks simple to do. I haven't done it yet, but I will very soon



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boostedinaz
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981446 posted 04/01/11 09:47 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I have blocked the FIAV on all my DSMs and 1101. For 1101 I just filled the FIAV with JB weld and let it cure for a day or two. That left the IAC to control the idle and it worked perfectly. Rock solid idle all the time and it even had a high idle for warm up in the mornings.



Michael
The rebuild of 1101

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cheekychimp Galant VR4.org Moderator
Director of Housing and Urban Development, and carbon/kevlar balls


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981447 posted 04/01/11 09:50 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Sounds like a plan then. What does the EGR block off do? We have no emissions laws over here so any disadvantages to doing this while I am in there?



Getting old sucks ... but it sure beats the alternative !!!


Edited by cheekychimp (04/01/11 09:50 AM)

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alansupra94
Excuse the retarded question.
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981508 posted 04/01/11 12:43 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I am tempted to do this mod. But my car is fine right now so I dunno



1992 Galant VR4
1996 Toyota Supra TT


Edited by alansupra94 (04/01/11 12:44 PM)

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SouthCaliVR4
Gas Analyzer
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981509 posted 04/01/11 12:46 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting cheekychimp:

Sounds like a plan then. What does the EGR block off do? We have no emissions laws over here so any disadvantages to doing this while I am in there?




with tuning blocking the EGR will give you more power but the Egr does allow for more aggressive timing so you may see some knock on a stock tune.



How do you make a small fortune racing? Start with a very large one!!!

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SleepinGVR4
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981517 posted 04/01/11 01:25 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I just figured no one in the galant/dsm community gives a sh*t about emissions so they removed them. Also if you car has some miles they get totally caked up with carbon build up.



Sean

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belize1334
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981524 posted 04/01/11 01:56 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I like blocking the FIAV but keeping the ISC. It helps with stabilizing the rpms when you apply the brakes (boost draws vacuum) and accessories. I've also tried with both blocked and the drivability wasn't as good. The idle raises considerably after the engine warms up so you either have to baby it on cold-start or be happy with a fast-idle after it's all warmed up... Recently I've been thinking about re-enabling the FIAV and blocking the ISC. That'd remove the electric control but allow for better cold-start...



Roger B. Scott
'91 Belize Green


Edited by belize1334 (04/01/11 01:57 PM)

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1990ggsxnj
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981528 posted 04/01/11 02:16 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I've done the block off (screw in method with JBWeld) on a few cars and in cold temps had no issue keeping an idle at first startup. The ISC did just fine, though as stated already - took a few more cranks and sometimes a second of throttle to get it idling normally.

Btw, 3 out of 4 adjusters were easy as pie to adjust down.. the runt of the litter was a B*tch! Blow torch and all it took like an hour and a half to get it all of the way down.



"Is that Spool Drool? EWW!"
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Edited by 1990ggsxnj (04/01/11 02:22 PM)

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cheekychimp Galant VR4.org Moderator
Director of Housing and Urban Development, and carbon/kevlar balls


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981701 posted 04/02/11 01:41 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting SouthCaliVR4:

Quoting cheekychimp:

Sounds like a plan then. What does the EGR block off do? We have no emissions laws over here so any disadvantages to doing this while I am in there?




with tuning blocking the EGR will give you more power but the Egr does allow for more aggressive timing so you may see some knock on a stock tune.




That's great info!

If that's the case, I'll probably just clean everything up for now and consider an EGR block off if I end up putting ECMLink in this car at a later date.



Getting old sucks ... but it sure beats the alternative !!!


Edited by cheekychimp (04/03/11 03:51 PM)

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turbowop
Hard Snarker
1051/2000



Galant VR-4 org Post #: 981717 posted 04/02/11 03:48 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I blocked off the FIAV on 1051 back in the day when it was giving me cold idle surge. I used the JBweld method and kept the ISC functional. Problem solved and no issues. That car also has no EGR valve as the Magnus intake manifold has no provision for one, nor does any other aftermarket intake manifold as far as I know.

On 503 the EGR is blocked off, but I kept the FIAV and ISC both functional as I didn't have any idle issues. Now I'm starting to get some surge if I drive it before it's fully warmed up after startup, so pretty soon one of these weekends I'll probably pull the throttle body and block off the FIAV. It's my ski car and sees some pretty cold temps up on the mountain, but I think it'll be fine.



-Mark

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dsm10o0
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 988543 posted 04/27/11 01:17 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Didnt want to make new thread so ill bump this one up since its only a few weeks old.

Anyone got a link to the JB weld method?

Ive been having a really high idle at first start up and once warmed up, it surges until its fully hot, it settles down to normal idle.



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bazeng
work in progress


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 988601 posted 04/27/11 07:11 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I'm getting Idle surge also, maybe the FIAV blockoff is the way to go?

Great timing to revive this thread!



Australia's Slowest VR4

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boostedinaz
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1101/2000


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 988622 posted 04/27/11 09:31 AM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Quoting dsm10o0:

Didnt want to make new thread so ill bump this one up since its only a few weeks old.

Anyone got a link to the JB weld method?

Ive been having a really high idle at first start up and once warmed up, it surges until its fully hot, it settles down to normal idle.




I can't remember the acual ports on the FIAV but I just take the lower portion of the TB off and get it nice and clean. Take some brake cleaner and spray it in one of the coolant lines and see what "square" it shoots our of then repeat for the other coolant line. Those are thep assages you want to block off. When I did mine I also took a thin piece of sheet metal and clamp it to the FIAV so the JB weld would be nice and flush with the mouting service.

I hope that made sense.



Michael
The rebuild of 1101

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Jesse_W
Unregistered


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 988655 posted 04/27/11 12:53 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I use this guy on most of the dsm's ive had once the FIAV started leaking. Eliminates the the FIAV and keeps the ISC. Like said earlier takes a few more cranks on cold mornings but other than that it worked pretty well.



Quoting belize1334:

I like blocking the FIAV but keeping the ISC. It helps with stabilizing the rpms when you apply the brakes (boost draws vacuum) and accessories. I've also tried with both blocked and the drivability wasn't as good. The idle raises considerably after the engine warms up so you either have to baby it on cold-start or be happy with a fast-idle after it's all warmed up... Recently I've been thinking about re-enabling the FIAV and blocking the ISC. That'd remove the electric control but allow for better cold-start...






I bought a TB that all ports have been welded shut FIAV and ISC both removed. The guy i bought it from had tapped a bolt that i can screw in and out to adust idle. That works pretty well expecially with idle, its a bear to start when its cold,but since install ive never had another idle problem.

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Hondakiller
Member


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 988696 posted 04/27/11 03:17 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
I got the FIAV block off plate. but I also don't have the A/C anymore. Car runs and stars great.

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razordsm
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 991517 posted 05/07/11 02:12 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
If you have the cyclone intake or JDM ecu there is no EGR valve. So you'd allready be blocked off

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cheekychimp Galant VR4.org Moderator
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 991587 posted 05/07/11 10:01 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
^^^ Now you tell me!



Getting old sucks ... but it sure beats the alternative !!!

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cheekychimp Galant VR4.org Moderator
Director of Housing and Urban Development, and carbon/kevlar balls


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 998668 posted 06/10/11 04:59 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Right, update!

A while ago I picked up an EVO III intake manifold with a really good condition throttle body on it. I pulled the throttle body apart and separated the ISC and FIAV assembly from it. I then installed that bottom half onto the S90 billet throttle body together with a brand new ISC from DSMISC.com and the JNZ FIAV block off plate I had ordered to fix my idling issues.

But no dice! The car started but idled at 2000 rpm no matter how we adjusted it. The car had been idling better than that previously so despite the fact that I suspected the old ISC to be going bad, we put it back in anyway. Instantly the car starts idling as smooth as butter ...

We put both ISCs side by side and the one from DSMISC.com is a good 1/8 of an inch shorter than the stock JDM one hence the fact that it was leaking air and not sealing properly leading to the high idle. I thought initially that maybe the EVO III throttle body itself was different but I realized it couldn't be that since the stock JDM ISC that we put back in was from a JDM VR4 throttle body. I suppose I should throw the EVO III ISC in just to confirm if it works and if it does keep it as a spare since these 'brand new' ISCs I have aren't much use as they stand.

So anyone heard of this issue before? DSMISC.com says the ISCs should work for VR4s, so I can only guess the USDM VR4 throttle body is different or you guys using the DSMISC.com ISCs are also using the bottom half of a DSM throttle body.

At least I have a decent idle now. Only issue is starting the car cold with the A/C cranked on full (17 degrees). Without A/C or on a moderate setting it starts straight off the bat.

But it STILL hunts badly and stalls on hot starts if switched off for 15 minutes or less. I cannot for the life of me figure out why. I heard that there is some sort of code in the ECU for hot starts. What does that incorporate and could it be causing any issues?

Guess I also need to work out how to test the resistance in the coils on the old ISC to see if it is really going bad and then maybe try to find a decent DSM lower throttle body section so I can use these damn new ISCs I bought.


Edited by cheekychimp (06/10/11 05:05 PM)

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chrisfullwood
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 998669 posted 06/10/11 05:08 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
ill look tonight, i just got a replacement throttle body (fully rebuilt) and i got a new ISC from DSMISC, so when i get back to my house ill do a comparison of the brown ISC i have, and the new black one i just got, and let you know what i find.



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boostedinaz
Fatty McButterpants
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Galant VR-4 org Post #: 998681 posted 06/10/11 06:28 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post      
Make sure the TB is grounded and that the idle switch is set up correctlty or ignored in DSMlink (not sure what tuning device yo are running).

If not my guess if that the block off plate my be letting in air. I always used JB weld abd make sure if was flusch so that the stock gasket would make the seal corectly. With a plate sandwiched in only one side has a nice tight seal.

Just my .02



Michael
The rebuild of 1101

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cheekychimp Galant VR4.org Moderator
Director of Housing and Urban Development, and carbon/kevlar balls


Galant VR-4 org Post #: 998700 posted 06/10/11 07:58 PM     Remind Me!  Send Private Message   Edit Post   
Quoting chrisfullwood:

ill look tonight, i just got a replacement throttle body (fully rebuilt) and i got a new ISC from DSMISC, so when i get back to my house ill do a comparison of the brown ISC i have, and the new black one i just got, and let you know what i find.




I'd appreciate that, thank you!



Getting old sucks ... but it sure beats the alternative !!!

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